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Combating hopelessness

friendofdorothy

Solidarity against neoliberalism!
fair enough. I campaigned for relationship rights when younger but when I heard Cameron saying that he supported gay marriage because he was a tory, it made me want to throw up. Still I'm glad of the legal rights to be next of kin that civil partnership has ensured. I still struggle with the concept of being respectable now - I was so used to being underclass I haven't quite adjusted yet and have to remind myself.

As a pacifist I find the whole gays wanting to be in the military a bit baffling. That said, I once dated someone who had been thrown out of the army for being queer, and had a friend who had been an officer on a ship the Falklands war, with medals and all. I can have sympathy for the individuals who want to 'serve' but no support for the military in general.
 

brixtonscot

Well-Known Member
fair enough. I campaigned for relationship rights when younger but when I heard Cameron saying that he supported gay marriage because he was a tory, it made me want to throw up. Still I'm glad of the legal rights to be next of kin that civil partnership has ensured. I still struggle with the concept of being respectable now - I was so used to being underclass I haven't quite adjusted yet and have to remind myself.
Agree friendofdorothy
The original Gay Liberation Front was a radical/revolutionary anti establishment movement for the sexual liberation of everybody - taking its name to echo the communist National Liberation Front in Vietnam that the USA were waging brutal war on at the time , and aligned with black & women's liberation movements - not for conservative homosexuals who crave to be allowed to partake in conservative institutions like the military and matrimony....( somebody said marriage is institution for those who want/need to be institutionalised )

Returning to work of Mark Fisher , one of his legacies is the concept of Acid Communism , a unfinished book of which he was working on when he died , the introduction is available online ( I'll see if I can find link )

The Acid Communism Facebook page has nearly 10,000 *Likes*

The concept of acid communism is a provocation and a promise. It is a joke of sorts, but one with a very serious purpose..... the convergence of class consciousness, socialist-feminist consciousness-raising, and psychedelic consciousness, the fusion of new social movements with a communist project...the sixties and early seventies had seen the left fail to connect with the 'collective euphoria' of the counterculture, leaving its embrace of freedom and pleasure to be colonised by the right. "
Mark Fisher
More Acid Than Communism
 
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FridgeMagnet

Administrator
fair enough. I campaigned for relationship rights when younger but when I heard Cameron saying that he supported gay marriage because he was a tory, it made me want to throw up. Still I'm glad of the legal rights to be next of kin that civil partnership has ensured. I still struggle with the concept of being respectable now - I was so used to being underclass I haven't quite adjusted yet and have to remind myself.

As a pacifist I find the whole gays wanting to be in the military a bit baffling. That said, I once dated someone who had been thrown out of the army for being queer, and had a friend who had been an officer on a ship the Falklands war, with medals and all. I can have sympathy for the individuals who want to 'serve' but no support for the military in general.
There is a modern subset of Tories who really are honestly personally liberal and anti-discriminatory. It doesn't contradict their political stance at all in their opinion. They might be naive as to how their position affects society and the discrimination that causes, but then you get the combination of ignoring details or sticking to a super theoretical ideological motivation because the results are painful (cognitive dissonance). We can win the war in some senses but people are adaptable, they can excuse their own selfishness pretty much regardless.
 

friendofdorothy

Solidarity against neoliberalism!
There is a modern subset of Tories who really are honestly personally liberal and anti-discriminatory. It doesn't contradict their political stance at all in their opinion. They might be naive as to how their position affects society and the discrimination that causes, but then you get the combination of ignoring details or sticking to a super theoretical ideological motivation because the results are painful (cognitive dissonance). We can win the war in some senses but people are adaptable, they can excuse their own selfishness pretty much regardless.
I know that Cameron liked to think himself oh so modern and liberal minded - but I still found him odious.

There is an old set of Tories too, who voted for Clause 28. Plenty of tories who voted against equal age of consent, against repealing clause 28, against the equality laws and civil partnership.

And now the Tories are lurching to the right I fear it is only a matter of time before they start attack workers rights, and to undo equality and anti-discrimation laws. I think we must remain vigilent and remember that hard won legal protections can easily be undermined and undone.
 

bellaozzydog

rolling turds in glitter
Today I’ve retreated from twitter facebook MSM and other shit.

i gave myself a rest from it all but over the last three days I dipped my toe back in and it’s left me fucking despairing

i’m not sure reading Mark Fisher is much good for me either :eek:

imgur and urban are the only things I can face.

on top of that i’ve got no English speaker to have adult conversations with till 20 jan :D I need a different life
 

campanula

diminished responsibilty
15 minutes of extra daylight already - I feel this and for sure I know my plants do. I rarely feel the need to defer to circadian rhythms (having the extra LED and sodium halide at my disposal)) but by fuck, I have grasped at any moments of usable light, these dark days. Seems like only dogwalks and weeding (my potential 'meadow') are keeping me afloat.
 

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friendofdorothy

Solidarity against neoliberalism!
I'm feeling really hopeful that the older queer group I attend in Brixton is going strong and plans are building for next year with increased links between our group and others including intergenerational plans with groups of younger queers. Having no children and very few younger relatives I think this is important. I made so many younger friends - they give me hope.
 

bellaozzydog

rolling turds in glitter
I'm feeling really hopeful that the older queer group I attend in Brixton is going strong and plans are building for next year with increased links between our group and others including intergenerational plans with groups of younger queers. Having no children and very few younger relatives I think this is important. I made so many younger friends - they give me hope.
intergenerational housesharing is the future:D I live with two 23 year olds and the majority of the time they inspire me and are Funny as fuck. just need to add an OAP and we have it all covered
 

CH1

"Red Guard"(NLYL)
Capitalism and Mental Health - I came across this TED Talk which resonated with me
Obviously this is more to do with subjective experience and the mental health system than it is with political analysis - but here it is
 

Serge Forward

Utopian materialist
I'm intrigued by the British vs Italian approach to community care.

In the UK were have had reports and policies going on about community care in care for the elderly and psychiatric care since 1956
Care in the Community - Wikipedia
They are syill arguing about it - but the main thrust appears to have been towatds closing state institutions and opening private ones - usually run bu people trained by the NHS.

On the other hand in Italy - regarding mental health - regarding mental health - Italy passed a law in 1978 requiring the phased closure of all mental hospitals, and mandating treatment in the community.
Psychiatric reform in Italy - Wikipedia

I recall back in the 1990s some groups such as the Hearing Voices Network going on exchange visits to Trieste, which was apparently in the vanguard
of developments in Italy. Clearly if the Italians are making genuine progress here it will be more difficult to evaluate and replicate here now were are Brexiting.

Not that anyone in the NHS will be interested in a European solution anyway. If they wanted that why did they put the newly knighted Sir Simon Stevens in charge of NHS England? Concurrently Angell Ward (Coldharbour) councillor 1998-2002 he was a new Labour policy wonk for Frank Dobson and Tony Blair before going off for a ten year stint at United Healthcare - first in New York then Brazil.

Sir Simon most likely knows more about private healthcare for the poor than any living soul in Britain - but how does that compare to community care in Italy. That is what I want to know.
There's a brief but interesting chapter in John Foot's book, "The Archipelago" on Italian mental health and care in the community. It seemed all very progressive, positive, person-centred and social-centred. I got the impression it had nothing at all in common with Thatcher's "care in the community" which dumped vulnerable people in deeper shit.
 
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8ball

Having a teeny break
There's a brief but interesting chapter in John Foot's book, "The Archipelago" on Italian mental health and care in the community. It seemed all very progressive, positive, person-centred and social-centred. I got the impression it had nothing at all in common with Thatcher's "care in the community" which dumped vulnerable people in deeper shit.
It's like that "Big Society" stuff - there are some ideas in there, just not in any Tory version.
 

Irish353.109

New Member
I wasn't sure where to post this.

I realised recently that I'd been on more demos, marches and written more letters/signed petitions in the last 2 years or so than in the previous two decades. (I used to do a lot of activist stuff back in the reign of Thatcher.)

So here we are again - the Torys, more austerity, more attacks on the NHS, the unemployed, the poor, the ill and the disabled. They are creating a deeply divisive society with ever increasing inequality between the 'haves and have nots' which sets everyone againgst each other. Its like being back in the gloom of 1980s - but much worse, with even less hope of any reprieve or change of govt policy.

I keep hearing people say what the point of protest, it won't change anything - how do we combat that defeatism?

Is anyone hopeful that this country can actually turn the tide and change for the better? What can we actually do? what orgasations, protests, stategies or philosophies offer any hope of a fightback?

I realise that back the 80s I coped because:
  • I thought there was every chance the Tory govt would fall, or be voted out next time
  • There was a lot of organised opposition to Thatcherism - from trade unions, political parties, terrorist groups and lots of single issue groups.
  • There was some idealised idea of rainbow coalition - that united the minorities could be the majority and win through to change things
  • I was young - I had the energy to fight and hadn't had all the hope worn out of me.
  • I beleived that you could win people over to your way of thinking by educating them one at a time.
None of those things apply now except the last one - which would suggest a long slog indeed.
I need ideas on how to face the struggle against the Torys and avoid depression and burnout.
I only moved to the U.K. in 2002 from Rural Ireland and our governments and our TD’s in Dáil Éireann were pretty bad, but today on balance, our present government and Taoiseach, in many ways, are even worse than those in the Thatcher years, as I still go home to Ireland frequently, at least once every 6 months, both summer and winter via Holyhead

- the homeless problem in Dublin and many other Irish cities and towns today, is even worse than here in Manchester and has gradually become so over the past decade

- it seems that only the far right or the hard left parties make any sense, as the mainstream parties in both Ireland and the U.K. are only career politicians, who do not care about ordinary people when push comes to shove, are only in politics for personal gain, have embraced such ideologies as globalism, pseudo-socialist, corporate-marxist, corporate-communism, corporate-leftism, etc, while being tied to an EU which is destructive and is tearing apart traditional family structures and society generally, regardless of the morality or ethics of this, for the politicians (on all sides) own personal advantage, which they regard as a good and “positive“ thing, regardless of reality
 

Pickman's model

every man and every woman is a star
I only moved to the U.K. in 2002 from Rural Ireland and our governments and our TD’s in Dáil Éireann were pretty bad, but today on balance, our present government and Taoiseach, in many ways, are even worse than those in the Thatcher years, as I still go home to Ireland frequently, at least once every 6 months, both summer and winter via Holyhead

- the homeless problem in Dublin and many other Irish cities and towns today, is even worse than here in Manchester and has gradually become so over the past decade

- it seems that only the far right or the hard left parties make any sense, as the mainstream parties in both Ireland and the U.K. are only career politicians, who do not care about ordinary people when push comes to shove, are only in politics for personal gain, have embraced such ideologies as globalism, pseudo-socialist, corporate-marxist, corporate-communism, corporate-leftism, etc, while being tied to an EU which is destructive and is tearing apart traditional family structures and society generally, regardless of the morality or ethics of this, for the politicians (on all sides) own personal advantage, which they regard as a good and “positive“ thing, regardless of reality
er the likes of nick griffin and nigel farage are just as much career politicians as any mp, the late john tyndall - long-time leader of the bnp - was despite his signal lack of electoral success just the same. not sure how you're defining career politicians but you might like to revisit it.
 

Gramsci

Well-Known Member
I only moved to the U.K. in 2002 from Rural Ireland and our governments and our TD’s in Dáil Éireann were pretty bad, but today on balance, our present government and Taoiseach, in many ways, are even worse than those in the Thatcher years, as I still go home to Ireland frequently, at least once every 6 months, both summer and winter via Holyhead

- the homeless problem in Dublin and many other Irish cities and towns today, is even worse than here in Manchester and has gradually become so over the past decade

- it seems that only the far right or the hard left parties make any sense, as the mainstream parties in both Ireland and the U.K. are only career politicians, who do not care about ordinary people when push comes to shove, are only in politics for personal gain, have embraced such ideologies as globalism, pseudo-socialist, corporate-marxist, corporate-communism, corporate-leftism, etc, while being tied to an EU which is destructive and is tearing apart traditional family structures and society generally, regardless of the morality or ethics of this, for the politicians (on all sides) own personal advantage, which they regard as a good and “positive“ thing, regardless of reality
My Spanish partner finds this country leaving EU a "destructive" thing. She was working and living here happily and now at end of month her status changes for the worse.

I dont quite follow your argument about career politicians and EU.

This goes for all my friends and workmates from other EU countries.

Brexit nightmare has been a stressfull time for them. And they still dont feel that secure here with a Boris led government. Given what he said during election about EU people treating this country as their own.
 
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Gramsci

Well-Known Member
On combatting hopelessness.

Im regular blood donor. Was asked due to my blood type to be platelet donor. Which I did few weeks ago.

In this country donation is unpaid and voluntary. Unlike say USA.

Its a non commodified social gift.

When Im waiting to do a donation the feeling of "hopelessness" disappears. All the people there in waiting area are doing this for no monetary gain to help others.

Its one of the utopian practical parts of the NHS that they never have tried to give people some knd of monetary incentive to donate. Just trusting the ordinary peoples good will.

Imo a good example to combat hopelessness.
 

friendofdorothy

Solidarity against neoliberalism!
On combatting hopelessness.

Im regular blood donor. Was asked due to my blood type to be platelet donor. Which I did few weeks ago.

In this country donation is unpaid and voluntary. Unlike say USA.

Its a non commodified social gift.

When Im waiting to do a donation the feeling of "hopelessness" disappears. All the people there in waiting area are doing this for no monetary gain to help others.

Its one of the utopian practical parts of the NHS that they never have tried to give people some knd of monetary incentive to donate. Just trusting the ordinary peoples good will.

Imo a good example to combat hopelessness.
thats a good example.

I find volunteering of all types fairly uplifting. Volunteers tend to be fairly happy people - doing something they love or enjoy doing with no monetary reward. It seems like the introduction of money into the equation just corrupts everything.
 
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