Chelsea and the Abramovic millions - good for football?

[iROBOT]

Consistent? If you took the players salaries from any of the top 4 clubs, you could probably stop millions of people from starving across the world....
Premiership supporters are not really in a very strong position to talk about Abrahamovics money ruining football....As though before he came everything was really hunky dory.

You telling me that Abramovic hasn't changed the nature of the EPL???

This isn't about how much they earn it's about Chavskum being ALLOWED to flood the market with ridiculous transfer fees that no other club can match.

In anyother business this just would not be allowed.

 

[tbaldwin]

What in any other business they would stop that happening would they?
I dont think so....Have you ever heard of Stagecoach?

 

[iROBOT]

No I dont...sorry.
What I meant, was that it's putting too much pressure on the market to say that life is the same as it was before the emergence of Chavski is inaccurate.

 

[stupid kid]

Anyway, what do you think of arsehole clubs like Chelsea - playthings for wankers - and would any decent club allow themselves to be taken for such a ride?

If by the club you mean the fans (ie the season ticket holders, and regular visitors) do they really have any say in the matter? Football is a big business now, regardless of our emotional attachments to our clubs. Man Utd fans couldn't do fuck all about being taken over* and neither could Chelsea fans, should they have wanted to for some reason.

*Not that it really seems to have made much difference from the outside, and their condescending predictions of how Man Utd would be big enough to survive this but it would hurt the Derbys and Sheff Utds have all come to nothing.

 

[stupid kid]

In anyother business this just would not be allowed.

You mean complete domination of the market? You're not using Microsoft Windows by any chance?

 

[iROBOT]

You mean complete domination of the market? You're not using Microsoft Windows by any chance?

They are now (in the senate) discussing wheather to break MS up. Please read.

http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/news/aa060700b.htm

I believe it's in appeal now.

The Chavski model would not be allowed into American sport.

 

[tangerinedream]

They are now (in the senate) discussing wheather to break MS up. Please read.

http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/news/aa060700b.htm

I believe it's in appeal now.

The Chavski model would not be allowed into American sport.

NO, maybe not, but the teams are far from community or supporter owned in the US. I think it's a bit misleading to point to the US for enlightenment, it's a bit like comparing Neil Kinnock to Mrs Thatcher, he's a lot better in a lot of ways, but not exactly great either.

 

[iROBOT]

Yes I get the point. The USA's system is very alien. Still this is the way things have panned out. Wish they hadn't, its interesting to see how things turn out with the hammers and (now) the pool entering the big spender league. Chavski will not be dominate. For that we can be thankful.

 

[tangerinedream]

Yes I get the point. The USA's system is very alien. Still this is the way things have panned out. Wish they hadn't, its interesting to see how things turn out with the hammers and (now) the pool entering the big spender league. Chavski will not be dominate. For that we can be thankful.

I don't give a toss whether or not Chelsea win the next 50 premier league titles to be honest. Still be a load of whores running round to help Rupert sell sky dishes. As said below, them that blame Chelsea know nowt.

 

[iROBOT]

Yes, this is where the real paymasters live. Everything's for sale.

 

[3_D]

This poignant video sums up exactly how I feel about Chelsea and the Abramovic millions, Sky Sports and the death of the game of football as i knew it.

You'll either get it or you won't.

 

[Pavlik]

I for one, am very happy to see fergie and man utd sticking two fingers up to chelski this season

thats my tuppence worth.

over and out

 

[iROBOT]

Interesting quote from Wenger on the subject.

"What is dangerous for us is once the financial potential of a club goes above the natural resources by far. We would be in trouble because we don't have that.

"At the moment we have income from the gates, television and sponsorship. But if it is that plus private gift then we cannot compete.

"At the moment we can because only one club has those resources but once three or four have that then the pressures on the salaries will be too big.

"Today the players say 'I earn less than at Chelsea but it is only one club'. But once that becomes the price of the market then you are in trouble because you cannot compete at all.

"When this kind of pressure is multiplied by three, four or five then you have no choice.

"If these clubs are not run according to their natural resources and £100million more is put in each time then you cannot compete."

Wenger also has reservations about investors who want to treat football clubs as a way of making cash quickly.

Asked whether he would welcome an approach by potential new owners he replied: "It depends on what values they have.

"If they have £100million to put into Arsenal Football Club and they want to make £200million it looks to me very dangerous for football and for the club.

"If they said 'here is £100million and I want to enjoy it and help the club to develop' then it is okay.

"But to find people who are prepared to put £100million, £200million or £800million into a club and is prepared to lose it them you must be lucky.

"For me Abramovich looks to be in a different world financially because if he loses his investment it is peanuts for him. You do not find many people like that."

 

[tangerinedream]

Interesting quote from Wenger on the subject.

Moan, moan, moan, poor little rich club etc etc. But when Premiership clubs have an annual head start of 30 million plus on their nationwide counterparts, Wenger isn't bothered. Wanker.

 

[iROBOT]

Moan, moan, moan, poor little rich club etc etc. But when Premiership clubs have an annual head start of 30 million plus on their nationwide counterparts, Wenger isn't bothered. Wanker.

Ten years ago Arsenal were in no better position then Mid table mediocrity. It's through winning things and building a fan base which justifies a larger stadium.With clubs now, overnight being able to buy who they like, side stepping the process of actually having to win things in order to be able to buy better players leaves zero chance of any of the beloved and much maligned "lower" teams fuck all chance without a sugar daddy.

West Ham will have 15 million to spend...from where? winning something last year? There's something wrong in that.

 

[tangerinedream]

Ten years ago Arsenal were in no better position then Mid table mediocrity. It's through winning things and building a fan base which justifies a larger stadium.With clubs now, overnight being able to buy who they like, side stepping the process of actually having to win things in order to be able to buy better players leaves zero chance of any of the beloved and much maligned "lower" teams fuck all chance without a sugar daddy.

For fucks sake, what do you think it is like for anyone outside the Premiership money game? - We can't get in without sugar daddies, because it's designed to keep the big clubs in place. We know this, you are posting up stuff people were saying 15 years ago about the impact of the premier league on the rest of the pyramid, but presenting it like it's revelatory material, just because it now concerns bigger sides too.

Ten years ago Arsenal were a very good side, they'd had a minor blip for a few years, but lest we forget, they won the league in 89 and 91 and the Uefa in 93. Then they were champions again by, er, was it 98 or 99? Hardly 'mediocrity' was it?

Your only defence now is to say something like 'market forces' to justify it all. In which case, investers like Abromovich have as much right as they want to invest in a company. You can't have the Gr££d l£gu£ gravy train and then complain when rich passengers want to ride the train.

Again and again and again I say, Ha ha ha, if the pr£m's fucked then good, serves everybody and anybody that didn't boycot the foul thing from the start.

 

[tangerinedream]

Ten years ago Arsenal were in no better position then Mid table mediocrity. It's through winning things and building a fan base which justifies a larger stadium.With clubs now, overnight being able to buy who they like, side stepping the process of actually having to win things in order to be able to buy better players leaves zero chance of any of the beloved and much maligned "lower" teams fuck all chance without a sugar daddy.

West Ham will have 15 million to spend...from where? winning something last year? There's something wrong in that.

Er, Utd, Arsenal, Liverpool,Chelsea earn millions and millions for simply being in a competition that virtually gift wraps their qualification for next year by giving them millions. Every Pr£mi£shit team gets given (given) millions (not sure how much nowadays, it was about £30million) just for being in the premiership.

Tell me exactly how Burnley, Preston, Cardiff etc are EVER going to match the level of investment over a long period of say, Charlton. Add up ten years and Charlton have revieved HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF POUNDS of extra revenue for being a mediocre to vaguely decent side in the prem. Let's take Preston as an example - They have had three play off finals and a top half finish in the last 4 years, let's assume they finish in the top half again.

Charlton (or say, Newcastle, or bolton, or whoever) have finished on average, about 12-16 places higher in the entire football pyramid, yet have been rewarded with an inordinately unfair amount of money for seasom, after season, after season - Why on earth do you cling to any notion of fairness or decency in the way clubs are rewarded?

Why do you think anyone should give a flying fuck about 'unfairness' in the top level of the game. It is a septic mess, a cartel, a honeypot for the corporate money men and the sooner people abandon the notion that it is of any value or merit, the better.

Abromovich, Lerner, Dr Evil at Upton Park, whoever is not the problem. You cannot justify talking about 'fairness' while gross inequality exists with the distribution of wealth in the game.

I could go on and on and on and on and on.

 

[3_D]

For fucks sake, what do you think it is like for anyone outside the Premiership money game? - We can't get in without sugar daddies, because it's designed to keep the big clubs in place. We know this, you are posting up stuff people were saying 15 years ago about the impact of the premier league on the rest of the pyramid, but presenting it like it's revelatory material, just because it now concerns bigger sides too.

Ten years ago Arsenal were a very good side, they'd had a minor blip for a few years, but lest we forget, they won the league in 89 and 91 and the Uefa in 93. Then they were champions again by, er, was it 98 or 99? Hardly 'mediocrity' was it?

Your only defence now is to say something like 'market forces' to justify it all. In which case, investers like Abromovich have as much right as they want to invest in a company. You can't have the Gr££d l£gu£ gravy train and then complain when rich passengers want to ride the train.

Again and again and again I say, Ha ha ha, if the pr£m's fucked then good, serves everybody and anybody that didn't boycot the foul thing from the start.

Fuck me, that's a good post. Can I quote you?

 

[iROBOT]

I could go on and on and on and on and on.

You already have.

I get what you are saying there is gross inequality.

I'd hate it if the Hill-Woods..et al, sell up. But we see that even in the lower leagues a lot of "middling" millionaires taking up clubs with the hope of achieving what Man U/Chelsea have achieved. They all slag it but they all want to be there. Boltons a good example. I think Reading (if they can keep their manager) are well on the way to Prem success.

We live in interesting times.

 

[tangerinedream]

You already have.

I get what you are saying there is gross inequality.

I'd hate it if the Hill-Woods..et al, sell up. But we see that even in the lower leagues a lot of "middling" millionaires taking up clubs with the hope of achieving what Man U/Chelsea have achieved. They all slag it but they all want to be there. Boltons a good example. I think Reading (if they can keep their manager) are well on the way to Prem success.

We live in interesting times.

I wish we did.

We live in boring times as far as top level football is concerned imo, to be honest, at least with more investors you can envisage some level of competion being injected.

You know what, I touted Coppell for the England job last time round, and everybody scoffed. Shows you that very occaisionally I'm right.

As for Reading, Madjeski wants out as far as I know, because he know he can't compete financially in the Prem, so unless unbeknownst to me Reading have gained new backers, I wouldn't expect vast sums of cash to be splashed by them.

 

[tangerinedream]

Fuck me, that's a good post. Can I quote you?

Happily.

Oh look, I've quoted you.....

 

[iROBOT]

Well the next few years are make or break for the Prem, that's for sure.

And the repetitive quality to the eventual winners of the Prem may be boring, the football's certainly not. Chavski V Arsenal was a great game over the weekend. That Chav goal was sublime.

 

[iROBOT]

tangerinedream
Ten years ago Arsenal were a very good side, they'd had a minor blip for a few years, but lest we forget, they won the league in 89 and 91 and the Uefa in 93. Then they were champions again by, er, was it 98 or 99? Hardly 'mediocrity' was it?

Just read this.

Ten years ago Arsenal were heading towards the same state of the seventies, mid table mediocrity. Trust me I've been a Gooner since 1973, EVERY Gooner thought that.

I digress...carry on.

 

[ivebeenhigh]

This poignant video sums up exactly how I feel about Chelsea and the Abramovic millions, Sky Sports and the death of the game of football as i knew it.

You'll either get it or you won't.

yeah they are a bit off with the whole Hillborough conclusion though - all seating = bad - something had to be done.

It would be interesting to know how many clubs actually are still in existence due to the increased funds within the game too.

 

[tangerinedream]

Just read this.

Ten years ago Arsenal were heading towards the same state of the seventies, mid table mediocrity. Trust me I've been a Gooner since 1973, EVERY Gooner thought that.

I digress...carry on.

But you had just signed Dennis Bergkamp.

I am sorry if I offend by saying I've heard the 'Arsene Wenger built Arsenal out of nowt but a bit of spit and an old tea towel' story too many times.

You weren't exacty povery stricken were you? Terry Henry, Anelka, Overmars, Petit, Vierra, were brilliant, astute, clever, frugal, well timed signings, but they were ones that say, Watford could never have made. Keeping the likes of Adams, Dixon, Wright, Keown, Seaman can't have been cheap either - beyond the pocket of most prem sides I reckon.

Wenger is a genius and Arsenal are by far the least hateful (in my opinion) of the dominant forces BUT - 'little' - no, never.

I will trust you on how bad it was late Graham/Rioch era though.

 

[tangerinedream]

It would be interesting to know how many clubs actually are still in existence due to the increased funds within the game too.

I see, you think it 'trickles down' don't you...

We get fuck all from the gravy train. Just a few quid for shitty highlights rights and an occaisonal few grand for a sky game (in our case, about once every 2.5 years)

 

[tommers]

West Ham will have 15 million to spend...from where? winning something last year? There's something wrong in that.

yeah, terrible isn't it?

honestly the state of football today! awful business. everyone should just let arsenal, liverpool, man u and chelsea run things how they want to.

 

[ivebeenhigh]

I see, you think it 'trickles down' don't you...

We get fuck all from the gravy train. Just a few quid for shitty highlights rights and an occaisonal few grand for a sky game (in our case, about once every 2.5 years)

Does it not?

I understand that the money means that the top 10 teams or so will always be in the premiership, but hasnt that really always been the case?

Anyway I wouldnt worry about it. Soon the premiership will mean nothing the champions league will replace it and the lague structure will have to be reformed.

 

[tangerinedream]

Does it not?

I understand that the money means that the top 10 teams or so will always be in the premiership, but hasnt that really always been the case?

Anyway I wouldnt worry about it. Soon the premiership will mean nothing the champions league will replace it and the lague structure will have to be reformed.

No - how exactly do you envisage it 'trickling down?' If you give Liverpool £50million, how does it benefit Tranmere in anyway, shape or form

and

No. I suggest you read the league tables between 1888 and present day and get back to me regarding the above.

Are you aware of much to do with football or are you just passing comment from a disinterested perspective?

 

[iROBOT]

yeah, terrible isn't it?

honestly the state of football today! awful business. everyone should just let arsenal, liverpool, man u and chelsea run things how they want to.

Arsenal did IT BY WINNING THINGS!!! HELLOOOOO!!!!

You's lot should try it some time (winning that is)...