cardiff's golden jubilee: but where was the previous capital?

Discussion in 'Wales/Cymru' started by Pickman's model, Dec 20, 2005.

  1. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

    i see that cardiff's celebrating its fiftieth year of being the welsh capital: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/4544472.stm

    i was surprised to learn that as i thought that cardiff had always, forever and a day, been the capital of wales. so, where was the previous capital and what possessed "them" to move it to cardiff?
     
  2. WasGeri

    WasGeri Banned Banned

    Pickmans, you just read my mind! I was going to ask the very same thing...
     
  3. Belushi

    Belushi 01 811 8055 R.I.P.

    We didnt have a capital as such, not having any cities until relatively recently. Machynlleth was Owain Glyndwrs capital and where the Welsh Parliament he called met, and Ludlow at one point during the Midle Ages.
     
  4. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

    so with those two fine places having 'form' (or pedigree), why make cardiff the capital?
     
  5. Belushi

    Belushi 01 811 8055 R.I.P.

    I presume because it was the biggest and most important City. The Welsh Office etc were based in Cardiff prior to it actually becoming the Capital.
     
  6. editor

    editor hiraethified

    Probably something to do with it being one of the world's biggest ports, the city with the largest population in Wales, its closer proximity to London, its excellent transport links and - thanks to the coal trade - it being the commercial powerhouse of Wales.
     
  7. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

  8. editor

    editor hiraethified

    At the turn of the 20th century, Cardiff was a bigger port than New York!
     
  9. editor

    editor hiraethified

    Looks like we had to really grovel to get our capital then.

    :mad: :mad: :mad:
     
  10. Belushi

    Belushi 01 811 8055 R.I.P.

    I take it you refused to sign the petition then Ed :p
     
  11. editor

    editor hiraethified

    Instead of grovelling to that crowned fucker, we should have called out to Owain Glyndwr to return from wherever he's been having a pint and taken back all of our lands.

    :mad: :mad: :mad:
     
  12. fanta

    fanta Banned Banned

    Ungrateful bastards.
     
  13. nogojones

    nogojones Well-Known Member

    ...because it's the only part of Wales that is at all civilised.
     
  14. Brockway

    Brockway New Member

    Before the English allowed us to have Monmouthshire back as part of Wales both Rumney (Cardiff eastern suburb) and St Mellons were officially part of England. :eek:
     
  15. editor

    editor hiraethified

    That reminds me... <editor rummages about in box> ... here's this cool tin box that my granddad gave me commemerating the 1907 visit of King Edward and Queen Mary to Keyaaaardiff.

    It came with two medals too (I've still got one somewhere). Wonder if it's worth anything? (not that I'm going to flog it).

    [​IMG]
     
  16. Udo Erasmus

    Udo Erasmus Well-Known Member

    In the same period, South Wales had a similar rate of immigration to the US with a huge influx of migrants
     
  17. RubberBuccaneer

    RubberBuccaneer Hedd Wyn

    there's an article in the Echo today about it as luck would have it, to go with an improved national profile , politicians lobbied for a capital, it went to a vote between Cardiff , Caernafon,and Aberystwyth.
    For years the issue was considered too sticky for fear of upsetting other towns.

    I wish someone else got it and all the crap buildings that go with it. :mad:
     
  18. Brockway

    Brockway New Member

    Anybody know why there is such a large Italian community in Cardiff/South Wales? What were they fleeing? Or was it purely economic?

    PS Did you know that the first mosque in Britain was set up in Cardiff in 1860? For this reason alone we deserve to be the capital. :cool:
     
  19. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

    not a lot of people know that in the early 1950s, aberwrystwyth was in with a fair chance of becoming welsh capital -- till the mayor of aberwrystwyth chucked down the front of anthony eden's wife's blouse at a garden party at buckingham palace.
     
  20. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

    i don't see why you intend that to impress people.
     
  21. Dai Sheep

    Dai Sheep Member

    The cheek of that newspaper article...

    the Kings 'subjects'...the fucking nerve of some people.

    The royal family are in-bred, over-priveleged twats, who have done nil for Wales, yet the ignorant masses still come out waving Union Jacks in their thousands when they visit. Republic all the way! - Welsh republic preferably.
     
  22. RubberBuccaneer

    RubberBuccaneer Hedd Wyn

    It whows a tolerance to new immigrants that you could argue modern capials need.
     
  23. Pickman's model

    Pickman's model every man and every woman is a star

    it's interesting that newspaper reports of the 1950s do not highlight the mosque's role in securing capital status for the newcastle of wales.
     
  24. Brockway

    Brockway New Member

    Is it? I never said that the mosque had any role in securing capital status for Cardiff. :rolleyes:
     
  25. Karac

    Karac Mae Hen Wlad Fy Mamau

    Dont know if this is exactly true-but the story i heard was that unscrupulous Ship-owners would agree to take hard-up Italians to New York and then dump them off in Cardiff instead.
    Apparently a fair few of these new arrivals were none the wiser for many years. :eek:
     
  26. 1927

    1927 Funnier than he thinks he is.

    At that time Barry was more important in terms of trade than New York. What went wrong?
     
  27. neprimerimye

    neprimerimye Well-Known Member

    Thats probably a myth.

    From talking to a fair few Italian Welsh over the years it would appear that most of them walked here. As far as i know there were no direct sailings from Wales to Italy in any case. (Though pre-1914 Cardiff ships did get all over from Fray Bentos to Philadelphia to Sebastopol to St Petersburg and thats just the cities I know for a fact my Grandfather visited.)

    Many Jews fleeing Eastern Europe on the other hand were landed in London and told it was New York.
     
  28. Brockway

    Brockway New Member

    Yeah but with regards the Italians was it simple economic migrancy or was there something going on in Italy that caused the exodus?

    The jewish writer/documentary film-maker Jon Ronson who is from Cardiff, says his Lithuanian forefathers were escaping pogroms in the east. They were on their way to New York but simply ran out of money, so ended up staying in Cardiff. I'm sure a lot of people got to Cardiff intending to go to New York, found work and decided to stay. Certainly the Cardiff to New York shipping run was very active (see Eugene O'Neill's Bound East For Cardiff).

    One of my grandfather's was in the merchant navy and we donated his log books to the Industrial and Maritime Museum when it was in Cardiff. Unfortunately the museum has now moved to Swansea and taken our family heritage with it!
     
  29. RubberBuccaneer

    RubberBuccaneer Hedd Wyn


    I feel a commando raid coming on!

    The older Italians in Splott seem to have come after the war, so it may well have been economic then.
     
  30. Belushi

    Belushi 01 811 8055 R.I.P.

    The Italian Cafe was a feature of the Valleys communities for generations, there are still a few around like Segadellis in Crynant in the Dulais Valley.

    There were also many Spanish immigrants who came to work in the mines, their descendants still live in villages like Abercrave in the Upper Swansea Valley.
     

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