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Calzaghe quits boxing Undefeated

I'm afraid he didn't. He was dead lucky to get the decision. He did that to Roy Jones for sure but he wasn't interested in fighting at all.

Jesus Christ-for a poster that claimed Jeff Lacy was over the hill at 27 you take the biscuit.
He was "dead lucky" to get the decision against Hopkins?
Surely you need to throw the odd punch against your opponent in a boxing match if you hope to win?-Hopkins failed to do that (after round 2)
 
saw him in town with his missus today, goin up past the old arcade pub off st mary st
he had more shopping bags than her :D

no one was hassling him/them either :)
 
Calzaghe could have made himself box office material by going to the states and fighting there earlier in his career - he chose not to and only fought in the states for the first time against an old Hopkins. If you want hype you have to go after it in some way - either by going to the states or by making a lot of noise for the cameras at other fighters' press conferences just as David Haye has been doing recently. Calzaghe done neither of these.

He is no different to guys like Dariusz Michalczewski. He was a very good fighter but chose to stay in Europe and play it safe while pretending throughout his career that he wanted to fight the top guys. It was just a sham and Calzaghe does not deserve acclaim for fighting Hopkins and Jones when they were well past their best.

Sorry mate

but you are wrong!

Basically you are saying if you make lots of noise you become a world class fighter

do you fuck

BTW theres news for you CALZAGHE IS A BOX OFFICE HIT

how can you compare him to Dariusz Michalczewski??

did he hold a world title for over 10 years and win all 4 belts at one weight??

no

Hopkins was past it was he??

tell that to Kelly Pavlik
 
Basically you are saying if you make lots of noise you become a world class fighter

Err, no. That's you misreading what I did say. :rolleyes:

BTW theres news for you CALZAGHE IS A BOX OFFICE HIT

Couldn't give a fuck if he is PPV on every fight and sponsored by Weetabix.

how can you compare him to Dariusz Michalczewski??

Their tacitcs were the same. Win a title and spend most of their careers in Europe playing it safe.

did he hold a world title for over 10 years and win all 4 belts at one weight??

The alphabet soup argument means nothing. The fact is he didn't care to fight quality fighters until they were past it. He wouldn't risk it when they were younger and could have beat him.

Incidentally, Michalczewski held 3 titles at light heavyweight. It was no coincidence that he didn't want the 4th one - Roy Jones held that one and just like Calzaghe, Michalczewski did not want to go to the US and fight him when he was in his prime.

Are you trying to tell me you don't see the similarities between these two Euro fighters playing it safe? ;)


Hopkins was past it was he??

I said "old" and for a boxer he is old - and past his best.
 
Their tacitcs were the same. Win a title and spend most of their careers in Europe playing it safe.

fighting Kessler, Lacey and Hopkins was not playing it safe (ask Kelly Pavlik)

The alphabet soup argument means nothing. The fact is he didn't care to fight quality fighters until they were past it. He wouldn't risk it when they were younger and could have beat him..

oh yeah your right he never fought younger, unbeaten, unified world champions like Kessler or Lacey did he?:rolleyes:

Incidentally, Michalczewski held 3 titles at light heavyweight. It was no coincidence that he didn't want the 4th one - Roy Jones held that one and just like Calzaghe, Michalczewski did not want to go to the US and fight him when he was in his prime. .


Boxing championships are set up so that you HAVE to fight a mandatory challenger, so over 10 years fending off mandatory challengers is hardly playing it safe, neither is fighting unbeaten unified champions like Kessler & Lacey, or an experianced Light heavyweight champion like Hopkins. I'll agree Calzaghe didn't fight anyone of world class stature for those 10 years , but that was because Ottke & Hopkins didn't want to fight him & Jones jr was at a different weight class.
You have to remember boxers take a risk every time they get in the ring
Calzaghe was champion, so why should he go to america
 
More than that, he was a huge risk to the 'bigger names', who weren't queueing up to face the risk of fighting an unbeaten boxer from Wales. Remember that a fight had been arranged with Hopkins many years ago, only for Hopkins to try and double the fee on the eve of the fight. That doesn't exactly speak of Hopkins being keen to fight the risky Welshman.

In this era of multiple belts and political shenanigans Calzaghe did the best anyone could have really expected. Haye's made a bigger splash largely because the heavyweight division is so moribund now.
 
More than that, he was a huge risk to the 'bigger names', who weren't queueing up to face the risk of fighting an unbeaten boxer from Wales. Remember that a fight had been arranged with Hopkins many years ago, only for Hopkins to try and double the fee on the eve of the fight. That doesn't exactly speak of Hopkins being keen to fight the risky Welshman.

In this era of multiple belts and political shenanigans Calzaghe did the best anyone could have really expected. Haye's made a bigger splash largely because the heavyweight division is so moribund now.

It's entirely fair to say that the other top fighters weren't madly keen on fighting Calzaghe, who seemed for much of his career to be a high risk low reward fight to take. But it's rather one-eyed to assume that Calzaghe and the people around him were blameless in this. Boxing is a business and Calzaghe was bringing in a huge amount of cash fighting weaker boxers at home for more than a decade.

There was, as there often is, a coincidence of interest between Calzaghe, Jones, Hopkins, Ottke etc. These fighters - or the people around them - simply didn't want any part of each other and taken together there was a grand total of one fight between any of them at anything close to their peaks. It's all rather a long way from the Hearns, Hagler, Duran and Leonard era - boxers who were probably more talented than the more recent crop but who made sure that they will all be remembered as greater than any of the later group.

The fact is that between fighting a rather shopworn Chris Eubank and taking on Jeff Lacey, Calzaghe stayed at home and spent ten years beating up relatively low risk fighters. Not all of these fighters were bad. Some were legitimate contenders. But instead of fighting a load of decent fringe contenders and a few top names, Calzaghe for many years fought a load of nobodies and a few decent contenders.

That isn't much to build a legacy on and Calzghe will be remembered as a great talent who used that talent cleverly and safely and only really tested himself at the end of his career. The fact is that five fights against high quality opponents, three of whom were past their best, is much less than his talent deserved.

I don't really blame Calzaghe for that, or any of the other boxers I mentioned. Boxing is a dangerous game and boxers have short careers (Bernard Hopkins excepted!). You'd have to be very brave or very foolish to take unnecessary risks. At the end of his career, his money well and truly made, Calzaghe did step up his competition and start to fight the best available. The best available weren't as good as they were earlier in his career but he beat was was then available.

The Lacey fight was a brilliant performance but in outboxing Lacey so comprehensively he actually made his achievement seem less impressive than it might have been. He exposed Lacey pretty thoroughly and Lacey's career subsequently has made that win look like less of an achievement than it did while Lacey was riding a wave of hype. Eubank and Jones were old when he fought them and were clearly lesser fighters than they once were, so while the names are impressive, few people are going to give Calzaghe the same credit he would have got for beating them at other stages in their careers. Kessler hasn't done much since he lost to Calzaghe but he's still fairly young and if he goes on to be a dominant champion, Calzaghe's resume will improve considerably.

Hopkins, despite being the oldest of the bunch, has actually done Calzaghe quite a big favour by putting a beating on the hugely hyped Pavlik subsequently. No matter how old his birth certificate says he is, nobody can really make an argument now that he was shot. He was no longer at his all time great peak but he was still a legitimate top 10 or even top 5 pound for pound fighter. Assuming that Kessler doesn't go on to have a spectacular career, the Hopkins fight, messy and all as it was, will go down as Calzaghe's biggest achievement and the closest he ever came to living up to his considerable talent. The Lacey fight by contrast will go down as his best, purest, performance and the one that highlight reels will draw from.

Calzaghe was arguably the most talented boxer Britain has produced since the war. But his actual resume isn't as good as a few other British boxers who didn't have his talent.
 
It's entirely fair to say that the other top fighters weren't madly keen on fighting Calzaghe, who seemed for much of his career to be a high risk low reward fight to take. But it's rather one-eyed to assume that Calzaghe and the people around him were blameless in this. Boxing is a business and Calzaghe was bringing in a huge amount of cash fighting weaker boxers at home for more than a decade.

There was, as there often is, a coincidence of interest between Calzaghe, Jones, Hopkins, Ottke etc. These fighters - or the people around them - simply didn't want any part of each other and taken together there was a grand total of one fight between any of them at anything close to their peaks. It's all rather a long way from the Hearns, Hagler, Duran and Leonard era - boxers who were probably more talented than the more recent crop but who made sure that they will all be remembered as greater than any of the later group.

The fact is that between fighting a rather shopworn Chris Eubank and taking on Jeff Lacey, Calzaghe stayed at home and spent ten years beating up relatively low risk fighters. Not all of these fighters were bad. Some were legitimate contenders. But instead of fighting a load of decent fringe contenders and a few top names, Calzaghe for many years fought a load of nobodies and a few decent contenders.

That isn't much to build a legacy on and Calzghe will be remembered as a great talent who used that talent cleverly and safely and only really tested himself at the end of his career. The fact is that five fights against high quality opponents, three of whom were past their best, is much less than his talent deserved.

I don't really blame Calzaghe for that, or any of the other boxers I mentioned. Boxing is a dangerous game and boxers have short careers (Bernard Hopkins excepted!). You'd have to be very brave or very foolish to take unnecessary risks. At the end of his career, his money well and truly made, Calzaghe did step up his competition and start to fight the best available. The best available weren't as good as they were earlier in his career but he beat was was then available.

The Lacey fight was a brilliant performance but in outboxing Lacey so comprehensively he actually made his achievement seem less impressive than it might have been. He exposed Lacey pretty thoroughly and Lacey's career subsequently has made that win look like less of an achievement than it did while Lacey was riding a wave of hype. Eubank and Jones were old when he fought them and were clearly lesser fighters than they once were, so while the names are impressive, few people are going to give Calzaghe the same credit he would have got for beating them at other stages in their careers. Kessler hasn't done much since he lost to Calzaghe but he's still fairly young and if he goes on to be a dominant champion, Calzaghe's resume will improve considerably.

Hopkins, despite being the oldest of the bunch, has actually done Calzaghe quite a big favour by putting a beating on the hugely hyped Pavlik subsequently. No matter how old his birth certificate says he is, nobody can really make an argument now that he was shot. He was no longer at his all time great peak but he was still a legitimate top 10 or even top 5 pound for pound fighter. Assuming that Kessler doesn't go on to have a spectacular career, the Hopkins fight, messy and all as it was, will go down as Calzaghe's biggest achievement and the closest he ever came to living up to his considerable talent. The Lacey fight by contrast will go down as his best, purest, performance and the one that highlight reels will draw from.

Calzaghe was arguably the most talented boxer Britain has produced since the war. But his actual resume isn't as good as a few other British boxers who didn't have his talent.


End of thread!
 
I find the whole issue a bit depressing, as a boxing fan.

Calzaghe's detractors, of whom there are many, assume that he ducked the best at their peak and could have made the fights that mattered if he really wanted to. His fans assume that he really wanted those fights and that everyone else was ducking him. The reality is that this is just how boxing works these days. None of these fighters had a financial interest in fighting each other and so none of them did fight each other, with the solitary exception of Jones and Hopkins once. Unfortunately the optimum career strategy, money wise, for boxers now is to get an alphabet strap against the weakest available champion and then squat on it in your home town for as long as possible.

Because it's relatively easy for European fighters to build a large domestic following the practice is more obvious in Britain and Germany but the underlying process is the same everywhere. Quite a few Asian boxers do it very obviously and in so far as an American can do it, they will too. The Glen Johnson's of this world are few and far between. That doesn't make the boxers concerned evil or cowardly. It makes them sensible. But it does indicate that something is seriously wrong with boxing (well, one more thing is seriously wrong with boxing).

All of these fighters would be remembered as legends if they had regularly fought each other. Nobody thinks less of Tommy Hearns because he fought the best and lost a few - those wins and those losses are what make his reputation unassailable. As it is all of these fighters, with the exception of Hopkins who managed through sheer longevity to put together a great resume, will be remembered in varying degrees as guys who didn't make optimum use of their talents.

For what it's worth, I think that Calzaghe would beat Ottke pretty handily and would have been an underdog but not a massive one against a peak Hopkins and Jones. We'll never know though, which is probably good for the wallets of the various fighters and promoters but certainly doesn't do much for their legacies.
 
Like who?

Lewis is the first name that springs to mind. Benn and Eubank are a couple with resumes that stand up well beside Calzaghe's although neither was as talented. Hatton may well also fit the pattern if he pulls off a result or two in his future fights. Although now that I think about it "quite a few" might have been pushing it.
 
Just over the road, i think they're good enough to go on the big boxing forums, informed and educated writing with point (you might well have done these already). In the old days you'd have been picked up a by regional paper 100%.Keep it up.
 
Skibbereen Eagle here I come!

I remember the Lacey fight clearly, despite having watched it half cut in a late bar. I hadn't seen much of Lacey, just clips of him demolishing people, but I was expecting him to destroy Calzaghe. That wasn't because I had bought into the Lacey hype, as I said I didn't know that much about him. It's because I thought that Calzaghe to that point was so protected that he must be a fraud.

After all, if his management and promoters had kept him fighting nobodies interspersed with an occasional decent but unspectacular fighter for a decade they must have identified serious shortcomings. They must know that he wasn't up to taking on the best. I confidently said as much to the people I was with. And Calzaghe then proceeded to shove those words down my throat as he completely dismantled Lacey.

He exposed Lacey so thoroughly that he changed my view entirely. Lacey, as we now know, was no world beater. But he was a hard hitting, young, hungry talent and quite legitimately one of the best in the division. Calzaghe made him seem slow, clumsy and inept. Lacey wasn't the best fighter Calzaghe would ever face. In fact he's the worst of the five big names Calzaghe fought. But it was the best Joe ever performed and it's the fight that most people will remember.

The thing is though it actually made me admire him more and like him less. When I thought he was a limited fighter making the most of his flawed talent, I thought fair enough. People have to make a living and nobody is required to get their face rearranged just to keep me entertained. When he made it clear that he was much better than that, I was a bit more irritated by his career trajectory. Still, that's the way boxing works nowadays and if I was a manager or promoter, as opposed to some random boxing fan who wants to see the best fights, I'd have advised him and Jones and the others to do the same thing.
 
Top posts as usual Nigel.

Question tho'. List me 10 legendary boxers/good boxers/boxers who have a star studded resume which stands way above and beyond that of Joe Calzaghe's.

Anyone for that matter.

Any weight, any era. 10 of them.
 
Lewis is the first name that springs to mind. Benn and Eubank are a couple with resumes that stand up well beside Calzaghe's although neither was as talented. Hatton may well also fit the pattern if he pulls off a result or two in his future fights. Although now that I think about it "quite a few" might have been pushing it.
Calzaghe beat Eubank and im possibly wrong but Benn said that Calzaghe would have beaten him had they fought
 
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