Buying train tickets = utter fucking shite

[baldrick]

I was just trying to scope for approximate price. But apparently it seems you can't which is crazy.

I agree.

Unless you're used to the system it's needlessly complicated.

I think train co's should tell you explicitly when their cheap tickets are released and also tell you what price they'll be when they are released.

Walk-up fares are getting so expensive now if you want to travel any distance that trains are turning into advance-purchase only

 

[editor]

I don't want to rent a car since it won't be necessary and I don't really agree with it but if it works out cheaper, it just shows transport strategy in the UK is bonkers.

You won't hear me disagreeing with that. Don't get me started on the endless merry-go-round of fat cat rail franchises...

 

[teuchter]

yeah cos that makes perfect sense.

Outgoing single is £23

Return Single is £112

Each.

There is nothing on their website that details that buying their tickets is a lottery where you have to guess the best time to buy them.

Price for a car for four days is £93

Looks like you've chosen an advance purchase single one way and then an open single (the most expensive type of ticket on the network) for the return journey.

I don't know exactly where you're going but FYI a saver return from London to Plymouth costs £65.

There is no way you should have to pay ANY more for that journey than £65 unless you are leaving London in the morning or evening rush hours (or arriving into London in the morning rush hour).


A saver return is a ticket that you can buy on the day and means you can use any train (bar the peak hour restrictions I mention above). No advance purchase necessary. And you can return any day you like within a month.

Check again for a couple of advance singles in a few weeks and you may find you can get something for less than £65.

Although it's often worth checking your options for buying two advance singles, you should always check what the regular saver return fare is because it's often the best deal and also allows you loads more flexibility.

 

[teuchter]

Walk-up fares are getting so expensive now if you want to travel any distance that trains are turning into advance-purchase only

That's not entirely true. As long as we don't let them get rid of Saver fares, or add more restrictions to them, off-peak travel with walk-up fares can be fairly reasonable and actually, the longer the distance, the better the value in many cases.

Peak-time / business travel, well, that's a different matter of course.

 

[King Biscuit Time]

That's not entirely true. As long as we don't let them get rid of Saver fares, or add more restrictions to them, off-peak travel with walk-up fares can be fairly reasonable and actually, the longer the distance, the better the value in many cases.

Peak-time / business travel, well, that's a different matter of course.

They have just taken the opportunity to fuck the t&c's of Young Person's Railcard Saver Returns, subjecting them to the same ban on traveling before 9.30 am. I always used to come back from seeing my Girlfriend very early Monday morning (on a deserted train), but that isn't happening any more.

 

[teuchter]

They have just taken the opportunity to fuck the t&c's of Young Person's Railcard Saver Returns, subjecting them to the same ban on traveling before 9.30 am. I always used to come back from seeing my Girlfriend very early Monday morning (on a deserted train), but that isn't happening any more.

Didn't know that. That's not good.

On the other hand, YP discounts are now available on all advance fares, I think.

Your girlfriend would be pleased to know you refer to her with a capital letter, I should think, by the way.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

the national rail website is a piece of piss to use

No it's not, it's full of bugs. At one point I was told I could only buy tickets from one operator, but that operator wasn't on the list of available options. And different laptops returned different prices, even though the exact same search options had been entered (something to do with the browser maybe? One was IE, one was Firefox)

and look!!! return tickets for £13. You couldn't do that in a car

No, but I could travel whenever I want, and not be tied to one service and risk paying a fortune if I miss it.

Contrast with 40,000 cars driving from Brimingham to Manchester that day all with one driver in them

Which is the true shambles?

That's kinda my point - it's completely insane that I would even consider driving long distance on my own when I'm not carting tons of gear with me, the train should be a no brainer.

But it isn't.

 

[Idaho]

That's kinda my point - it's completely insane that I would even consider driving long distance on my own when I'm not carting tons of gear with me, the train should be a no brainer.

But it isn't.

Yeah it's piss-poor. I can't figure out why if you go to switzerland, japan, france, etc, you can go places quickly and cheaply on reliable trains and yet it doesn't seem to bankrupt the entire country to do so. What are we missing that they have?

Geneva to small village - 1 hour on the main line, 40 minutes on the branch, about £8. Nice train. Bang on time, bought tickets from the office 5 minutes before travel.

Japan town to Tokyo. 1 hour commuter run off-peak (I did the peak once! ) £5 each way. The trains arrive and depart within a second of their advertised time.

etc...

 

[baldrick]

No it's not, it's full of bugs. At one point I was told I could only buy tickets from one operator, but that operator wasn't on the list of available options. And different laptops returned different prices, even though the exact same search options had been entered (something to do with the browser maybe? One was IE, one was Firefox)

that is weird and definitely shouldn't happen. but why the fuck would you use two laptops to look at the same website for the same trains? what is the point?

No, but I could travel whenever I want, and not be tied to one service and risk paying a fortune if I miss it.

25 quid, actually. as i found to my cost the other day

i'd like to pay £13 for a walk-up ticket too, but it's just not possible.

That's kinda my point - it's completely insane that I would even consider driving long distance on my own when I'm not carting tons of gear with me, the train should be a no brainer.

But it isn't.

i agree that the train should be cheaper than a car and sometimes it isn't.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

why the fuck would you use two laptops to look at the same website for the same trains?

I was getting cross and shouting at my laptop, so aqua had a go on hers

 

[baldrick]

lol you two are fucking ace

 

[teuchter]

What are we missing that they have?

A railway network that's been invested in properly for the last 25 years, and governments that don't give in to the road lobby so easily.



(By the way, the French system isn't actually better than ours, once you're off the TGV network.)

 

[aqua]

lol you two are fucking ace

what he meant was he was twittering and swearing so much and refusing the listen it was easier for me to use mine, book the tickets and tell him when I'd done it than trying to actually help him

 

[HerneHillBilly]

I recently encountered hassle when trying to book bike carrying facilities on the train. I booked the tickets through thetrainline.com and then attempted to book bikes and was informed that I should've gone gone through the rail operator (National Express).
That involved having to pay extra to rebook the tickets.
The whole thing could do with simplifying.

 

[Mitre10]

Martin Lewis of MSE fame apparently has a team of IT boffins working on a new search engine for the train system which he hopes will replace the current shambles.

According to one of their recent email newletters, they intend that this system will show the most useful bits first (ie. cheapest fares) and will also detail other helpful things such as jouney splitters where it will save money (eg from London to Edinburgh, could be cheaper to book London - Newcastle and Newcastle to Edinburgh as 2 seperate tickets, even though you remain sitting on the same train).

Will be bloody good if/when it comes out although I imagine its bloody hard to do.

He has managed the cheap airfare searcher though:

http://flightchecker.moneysavingexpert.com/


so fingers crossed for the train one coming soon.

 

[teuchter]

Martin Lewis of MSE fame apparently has a team of IT boffins working on a new search engine for the train system which he hopes will replace the current shambles.

According to one of their recent email newletters, they intend that this system will show the most useful bits first (ie. cheapest fares) and will also detail other helpful things such as jouney splitters where it will save money (eg from London to Edinburgh, could be cheaper to book London - Newcastle and Newcastle to Edinburgh as 2 seperate tickets, even though you remain sitting on the same train).

Will be bloody good if/when it comes out although I imagine its bloody hard to do.

He has managed the cheap airfare searcher though:

http://flightchecker.moneysavingexpert.com/


so fingers crossed for the train one coming soon.

I secretly enjoy the complexity of it, because having got to know my way around the system quite well over the years, it means that I can usually find a better fare than 75% of the population can.

It could do with a good bit of sorting out though. I think there ought really just to be one central website, that deals with all internet ticket sales, and which is well laid out and resourced. This would reduce a lot of the confusion for people looking for tickets.

Instead of having lots of different companies making slightly shoddy websites (that all feed off the same database anyway, as far as I know) why not pool resources and concentrate on doing one really well. The NRE one is OK but it does sometimes have a few bugs, and I don't think it is very well laid out or intuitive for people who aren't familiar with the system.

I must be an incredibly difficult thing to make work though. Anyone who has seen the printed versions of the fare manuals (several phone-book sized volumes) or perused the National Routing Guide, will understand the massive number of different options and permutations there are for any journey.

 

[King Biscuit Time]

Martin Lewis's train fare supercomputer

Its.....Just.....too......fucking....complicated.

How...can....two.....singles.....be....cheaper....than.....a....return.....

does......not.......compute...

I'm....going.....back.....to.....modelling.....the......first.....picosecond.....after......the......big.....bang....to....give.....myself......a......rest.

 

[Spymaster]

.... I've just got a first class single to Bury for £18 which sure seems worth the minimal effort needed to source it.

Well, you'll have three months to find a cheapo ticket so .....

But you shouldn't have to "source" tickets over months. That's bollocks.

You should be able to buy the cheapest available ticket for any given journey at the click of a button.

The system's a joke.

 

[teuchter]

But you shouldn't have to "source" tickets over months. That's bollocks.

You should be able to buy the cheapest available ticket for any given journey at the click of a button.

The system's a joke.

How far in advance do airlines release their cheapo tickets?

 

[Spymaster]

How far in advance do airlines release their cheapo tickets?

Dunno. Why?

 

[HackneyE9]

(By the way, the French system isn't actually better than ours, once you're off the TGV network.)

You're citing Alastair Darling there - and what's more it's bollocks.

The French regional train system is great, in terms of trains, prices and reliability. The actual network is a bit sparer than ours, because the country's so much bigger. But then again there aren't as many gaps as there are if you look at much of Wales and NW Scotland....

 

[pinkychukkles]

I recently encountered hassle when trying to book bike carrying facilities on the train. I booked the tickets through thetrainline.com and then attempted to book bikes and was informed that I should've gone gone through the rail operator (National Express).
That involved having to pay extra to rebook the tickets.
The whole thing could do with simplifying.

If you want to take bikes on the train and reserve spaces for them, it's not possible to do both online; find the train tickets you want and then ring up to book and pay, the operator will reserve the bike spaces then. No extra cost when I've done it.

 

[teuchter]

Dunno. Why?

Just wondering how it compared. You seemed to be saying that 2 or 3 months in advance was an unreasonably short amount of time. As the cheap tickets are issued for much the same reasons that airlines and other travel operators do, I'd be interested to see if their approach was significantly different.

 

[teuchter]

You're citing Alastair Darling there - and what's more it's bollocks.

The French regional train system is great, in terms of trains, prices and reliability. The actual network is a bit sparer than ours, because the country's so much bigger. But then again there aren't as many gaps as there are if you look at much of Wales and NW Scotland....

I'm citing personal experience, mainly.

Often the services on rural lines are very sparse, with only one or two trains a day. A couple of lines have been closed in the past 6 months or so and I think there are several more currently under threat. As I understand it, the worst services are the inter-regional ones which neither central government nor regional administrations are taking much interest in, and many of the closures are affecting these services.

I'm not saying that our railways are miles better than the French; just that once you take the TGV out of the equation (and the TGV is great), they aren't quite what they are often cracked up to be.

If there's a railway system we should be admiring, it is the German one, in my opinion.

 

[HerneHillBilly]

If you want to take bikes on the train and reserve spaces for them, it's not possible to do both online; find the train tickets you want and then ring up to book and pay, the operator will reserve the bike spaces then. No extra cost when I've done it.

I discovered that after I'd hastily booked tickets.
It is possible to book bikes on some web sites (ie. National Express). With some companies you don't have to book, others you have to phone, and with others it's possible online. Pretty confusing if you're not familiar with it

 

[Idaho]

But you shouldn't have to "source" tickets over months. That's bollocks.

You should be able to buy the cheapest available ticket for any given journey at the click of a button.

The system's a joke.

The walk on prices of tickets should be reasonable enough that pre-booking in advance is only someone one would do occassionally when your travel plans were set and you wanted to get even cheaper fares.