aurora green
Tectonic
I wonder to what purpose all this serves?
Why is the Evening Standard so hell-bent on slagging off Brixton?
Why is the Evening Standard so hell-bent on slagging off Brixton?
Brixton article in Evening Standard today
- Thread starter Stobart Stopper
- Start date
Perhaps we should all email the Standard and offer to help Joe Hills pack and move out.
That sounds right. The other thing is that crime in Lambeth as a whole and crime in Brixton specifically may differ quite widely.tantris said:
Brixton - roughly Coldharbour, Ferndale, Brixton Hill and Tulse Hill wards - is quite a small area and has specific propblems.
Ironically, a fair bit of Brixton crime is due to Joe Hill's "hordes of artists and crustafarians" i.e. the drugs tourists who flock to Brixton at the weekend and need someone to sell them their drugs.
In other words the very group coinsidered trendy and "edgy" by the appalling Hills is the group tormenting Brixton with its vile drugs tourism.
So, according to this analysis, it's Joe Hill and his trendy friends who are the real enemies of law-abiding Brixton.
I think such stories have the same function as a horror film. You know, when you're tucked up warm and safe in bed, switch on the telly and get deliciously scared by the Living Dead, or Aliens, or Michael Howard.aurora green said:
Evening Standard readers, on their way home to Penge, adore being scared by tales of dangerous Brixton. It sends delicious shivers down their spines.
Plus there's always a racist subtext: how could an area with a large ethnic minority population be anything other than a crime ridden ghetto, unfit for decent white folks?
etnea
EXTERMINIEREN
Slurp said:
Actually no, he's not. He's a very lovely bloke who I've known for many years.
And do you not think that perhaps he was (honestly) describing what it was like to be in a situation like that, rather than an indication of his overall selfishness and lack of concern for his fellow man? He could have said
"I was reviewing the concert for the Evening Standard… As people stomped towards the door, arms and legs were being crushed underfoot. But people didn't slow down, apologise or help anyone else. It was every man for himself. "
thus not portraying his own instinct for survival.
I suppose you would've lingered behind, trying to help out, maybe trying to get all the panicking people to calm down, cos you're clearly the bravest person in the world, and highly experienced in this kind of situation.
Plus there's the fact that some journalists are lazy bastards. It's so easy to stick camera team on the tube and send them down to Brixton.aurora green said:
I hope Joe Hills, or the woman (Lisa) allegedly threatened with gang rape, are urban75 members. I'd like to hear Joe Hill's defence.
I think Joe Hill's a bit like a Nazi concentration camp guard myself.
But he didn't say that. He said precisely what I quoted. He ran away and trampled people.etnea said:Actually no, he's not. He's a very lovely bloke who I've known for many years.
And do you not think that perhaps he was (honestly) describing what it was like to be in a situation like that, rather than an indication of his overall selfishness and lack of concern for his fellow man? He could have said
"I was reviewing the concert for the Evening Standard… As people stomped towards the door, arms and legs were being crushed underfoot. But people didn't slow down, apologise or help anyone else. It was every man for himself. "
thus not portraying his own instinct for survival.
I suppose you would've lingered behind, trying to help out, maybe trying to get all the panicking people to calm down, cos you're clearly the bravest person in the world, and highly experienced in this kind of situation.
And he is, according to his picture on page 22 of yesterday's Evening Standard, a tubby, balding, middle aged white man with a goatee.
Well, not a goatee exactly. More one of those "three day stubble" arrangements which some plump men affect in an effort to camouflage their double* chins.
* Tripple in the case of the brave Chris ES Esq
Edited to add: I think Chris ES is rather like a Nazi concentration camp guard. Sorry, but there you are.
Commendable of you to be so loyal but he nevertheless made himself look a total twat. What anyone else would have done in the situation is irrelevant. As a great big bloke he was in very little danger of being trampled himself but was happy to be the person doing the trampling. His impression that it was 'every man for himself' is purely subjective anyway.etnea said:Actually no, he's not. He's a very lovely bloke who I've known for many years.
And do you not think that perhaps he was (honestly) describing what it was like to be in a situation like that, rather than an indication of his overall selfishness and lack of concern for his fellow man? He could have said
"I was reviewing the concert for the Evening Standard… As people stomped towards the door, arms and legs were being crushed underfoot. But people didn't slow down, apologise or help anyone else. It was every man for himself. "
thus not portraying his own instinct for survival.
I suppose you would've lingered behind, trying to help out, maybe trying to get all the panicking people to calm down, cos you're clearly the bravest person in the world, and highly experienced in this kind of situation.
happyshopper
Well-Known Member
Where and when?
Getting back to the Evening Standard article, the question I would like to be answered is where and when did the event take place. Did anyone notice a car being smashed up by a mob of kids in the street? Not exactly an everyday event in my part of Brixton.
The incident sounds horrific for those concerned, whatever their occupation. The trouble is that from personal experience I don't believe a word of anything that appears in the Standard.
Just to put it on the record as someone who is, incidentally, white and middle class - the article bears no relationship whatsoever to my experience of living in central Brixton for the past 20 years. I am sorry to hear about anyone's bad experiences but my main conclusion is that the sooner the author of the article leaves Brixton the better off we will all be.
Getting back to the Evening Standard article, the question I would like to be answered is where and when did the event take place. Did anyone notice a car being smashed up by a mob of kids in the street? Not exactly an everyday event in my part of Brixton.
The incident sounds horrific for those concerned, whatever their occupation. The trouble is that from personal experience I don't believe a word of anything that appears in the Standard.
Just to put it on the record as someone who is, incidentally, white and middle class - the article bears no relationship whatsoever to my experience of living in central Brixton for the past 20 years. I am sorry to hear about anyone's bad experiences but my main conclusion is that the sooner the author of the article leaves Brixton the better off we will all be.
I wondered that too. There are no clues in the article.happyshopper said:
I'm tempted to raise this article at the next meeting of the Community-Police Consultative Group for Lambeth. If a local woman truly was threatened with gang rape, as the article claims, they ought to know about it.
Equally, if this white "reporter" is involved in manufacturing sensationalist lies about young black Brixtonians then the Consultative Group might care to take a, ahem, vigorous interest in the matter.
isvicthere?
a.k.a. floppybollocks
Blaming a whole area for a single incident is, frankly, risible. It reminds me of something I witnessed several years ago on Holloway Road station. A passenger had stuffed his hand in the door of a tube train, making it impossible for the train to leave. A war of wills ensued between the driver, who would not "back down" and open the door, and the passenger, who would not remove his hand. After a reasonably lengthy stand-off the passenger relented and withdrew. As he walked past me along the platform, he loudly complained, "This FUCKIN' country!" as if the entire nation (whatever that is) were collectively/cumulatively responsible for this ridiculous willy-waggling exchange.
isvicthere?
a.k.a. floppybollocks
tantris said:
How does that break down per capita? I imagine Lambeth has a higher population.
oryx
Sitting on the bok of the day
tantris said:
I think you've got an interesting point there.
I take what passes for journalism in the ES with a hefty pinch of salt. I've lived near, & been familiar with Brixton since the early 80s & have had dozens of friends who've lived there, & I've NEVER heard of this sort of thing in terms of the racist element. Also, as lots of people have already pointed out, criminal damage & intimidation by gangs of anti-social arseholes is hardly confined to Brixton & the ES's sub-text - that it is - is despicable. You could put that sort of negative spin on many bits of inner London but oh no, the ES has to choose Brixton.
If what the guy has written is all true, however, the "blame the victim" approach taken by some people on this thread is equally despicable.
To isvicthere?:
In 2001, Lambeth's population was 11.6% greater than that of Redbridge. The age profiles of the two boroughs were different as well. Lambeth had a higher proportion of people in their 20s than did Redbridge, but Redbridge had a higher proportion of those aged 19 years and under.
Note that this was four years ago, meaning that Redbridge may have as many or slightly more people aged under 30 today than Lambeth, the significance being that most crimes are probably committed by people aged under 30.
Young Lambethians are therefore on average at least twice as mental as young Redbridgians when it comes to several categories of crime, with the notable exception of vehicle crime.
To oryx: You're probably right. There is a distinct 'dinner party conversation' tone to Hills' article. There are other London boroughs which have similar crime levels to Lambeth's. At the level of individual districts, there are worse places crime-wise than Brixton eg Tottenham, parts of Hackney, Leyton, Stonebridge Park etc. But those don't show up on the radar of Evening Standard readers as often, if at all.
In 2001, Lambeth's population was 11.6% greater than that of Redbridge. The age profiles of the two boroughs were different as well. Lambeth had a higher proportion of people in their 20s than did Redbridge, but Redbridge had a higher proportion of those aged 19 years and under.
Note that this was four years ago, meaning that Redbridge may have as many or slightly more people aged under 30 today than Lambeth, the significance being that most crimes are probably committed by people aged under 30.
Young Lambethians are therefore on average at least twice as mental as young Redbridgians when it comes to several categories of crime, with the notable exception of vehicle crime.
To oryx: You're probably right. There is a distinct 'dinner party conversation' tone to Hills' article. There are other London boroughs which have similar crime levels to Lambeth's. At the level of individual districts, there are worse places crime-wise than Brixton eg Tottenham, parts of Hackney, Leyton, Stonebridge Park etc. But those don't show up on the radar of Evening Standard readers as often, if at all.
Donna Ferentes
jubliado
I'd like to know that too. And if they've really had three articles on the same day, I wonder if any of Brixton's elected representatives might be approached with a view to asking them what they're playing at?aurora green said:
hendo
Fish finger sandwiches
Thoughts about Hills article. It's slightly odd in that the key incident that's made him decide to move out and change his personality into the bargain wasn't actually witnessed by him.
The trigger seems to have been a look that 'Tim' gave the yoof, but 'he really can't remember'.
Why when 'Lisa's' car was being smashed did Tim 'play the incident down in the call to the police'?
Odd too that Hills didn't try to get the other side of the story for his piece. Apparently they only live on the other side of his street. Doesn't seem to have called the cops for a quote either. Given that the piece seems to imply that there's a reaction against recently arrived white residents in Brixton I'm a little suprised he didn't trouble either councillors or an MP.
Sorry Mr Hills; dinner party journalism is what this is, not proper reporting.
The trigger seems to have been a look that 'Tim' gave the yoof, but 'he really can't remember'.
Why when 'Lisa's' car was being smashed did Tim 'play the incident down in the call to the police'?
Odd too that Hills didn't try to get the other side of the story for his piece. Apparently they only live on the other side of his street. Doesn't seem to have called the cops for a quote either. Given that the piece seems to imply that there's a reaction against recently arrived white residents in Brixton I'm a little suprised he didn't trouble either councillors or an MP.
Sorry Mr Hills; dinner party journalism is what this is, not proper reporting.
That's putting it politely.hendo said:
Your dissection of this nasty piece of bigoted polemic is spot-on. I still doubt 'Joe Hills' and 'Lisa' exist.
dogmatique
merde alors
IntoStella said:
Let's get this in perspective - you make yourselves sound a bit ridiculous by insisting that crime doesn't happen in Brixton. Are you really saying that it's made up?
Please - we all agree that the guy's not really helped himself, but for fuck's sake!
I've had the misfortune to have been mugged in Brixton, and an unfortunate number of my aquintences have too - don't start a Stalinist denial of the facts.
The problem is is that this was an another article about Brixton's "problems" when it could just as easily have been an article about Hackney, or fucking Hainault or Notting Hill or ANYWHERE in London, but again they choose Brixton.
Don't marginalise yourelf with crass denial and conspiracy. There's plenty of rational reasons why this story is wrong - but don't deny that it did and does happen.
dogmatique
merde alors
hendo said:
I agree entirely.
Wee Beastie
calling all vegetables
Hahaha. Ridiculous.
Don't kid yourselves that this sort of thing ain't gonna happen to each and everyone of you. It's a lot closer than you think.
This guys whole attitude can be created in anyone by just one bad, scary incident.
It's all just a symptom of our society and it's happening in nearly every city and town up and down the country.
Hmmm, I dunno.
I prefer the zen buddhist approach of trying not to identify too much with myself.
Don't kid yourselves that this sort of thing ain't gonna happen to each and everyone of you. It's a lot closer than you think.
This guys whole attitude can be created in anyone by just one bad, scary incident.
It's all just a symptom of our society and it's happening in nearly every city and town up and down the country.
Hmmm, I dunno.
I prefer the zen buddhist approach of trying not to identify too much with myself.
Donna Ferentes
jubliado
I dreamed I read Joe Hills last night.
dogmatique said:
<Bit I've bolded> : Where, anywhere in this thread, does anyone claim that there is no crime in Brixton?? Stalinist denial of the facts my arse!
For fucks sake, the editor has himself described a horrendous incident he was subjected to on these forums, not so long ago.
People are casting doubt on the specific details of this particular story, and suspecting the bloke may have been exaggerating, possibly a lot, given the suspiciously vague and unverifiable details. There's a considerable difference between casting doubt on the details of one story in a dodgy paper with a track record of sensationalism, and "insisting that crime doesn't happen in Brixton"
If you can't tell the difference, you're either stupid, or a journalist, or both
dogmatique
merde alors
You can't tell me that there isn't a general knee jerk tendency in these parts to attack and deny things that people don't agree with as a matter of course.
Donna Ferentes
jubliado
Hmm, but your posting seems to be an example of same rather than a response to it.
