nino_savatte
No pasaran!
ViolentPanda said:
Quite and I would be equally suspicious of such posters. Our friend Rach, despite his protests, is quite clearly not what he says he is.
Boycotting Israel as a route to peace.
- Thread starter moono
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Quite and I would be equally suspicious of such posters. Our friend Rach, despite his protests, is quite clearly not what he says he is.
frogwoman
Let them eat newts
rachamim18 said:
No, i am not trying to suggest that at all.
i am merely wondering why you would disown the boys, but not the girls.
i never said israel was sexist, did i?
fair enough.
but that is a very different thing from presenting a physical threat to israel, is it not?
oh, i'm not defending them, at all.
that's a very different thing from supporting the actions of the israeli state, though, isn't it.
Are you saying they deserved it?
sorry to hear that.
oh, i know you can be jewish without being religious.
No, i wasn't
if you think i am like that, that i am anti-semitic, and do not understand my own religion, you couldn't be more wrong ... believe it or not - i know this.
do you?
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
In this post Rach claims to be 39 but in previous posts he has claimed to be much older.
frogwoman
Let them eat newts
rachamim18 said:
sorry if i offended you.
i actually have a very secular family, so there is a lot i don't know, and am still learning . of course ive seen that, but i don't know an awful lot about gematria.
i was just suspicious of some of the other htings you have said ...
tangentlama
Nameless voices crying
nino_savatte said:
No, actually, I always thought he said was born in 1967, and that's never changed to my knowledge. If I thought that was right, I'd agree with you, but I think that's not. Soz.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
tangentlama said:
Sorry but I don't remember that at all. I do rememvber him saying he was older than he recently stated.
tangentlama
Nameless voices crying
astronaut said:
a tangent is a tangent is a tangent.
now you have a triangle
which way it points is dependent upon your imagination.
Jonti
what the dormouse said
"Whatever happened to our ancestors yesterday, or 4000 years ago happened to us. Their blood runs through our veins. We are ONE people. "
Yes, we are one people. One Earth people. Is that what you meant?
Or are you just trying to set things up for a fight with some other tribe of earthlings?
Yes, we are one people. One Earth people. Is that what you meant?
Or are you just trying to set things up for a fight with some other tribe of earthlings?
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
iROBOT said:
As he says, it's the orthodox perspective, and the prohibition of the Kabbalah to women is for the usual reason; that of contamination.
As for the "certain men" point, one has to have "qualified" as worthy to study. Proving one's "manhood" alongside having studied scripture is a method for doing so.
That said, the orthodox perspective may constrain the orthodox, but that's all. Anyone thinking that no (Jewish or otherwise) women have studied Kaballah (by which I don't mean the faddish rubbish followed by celebrities) is naive.
frogwoman
Let them eat newts
nah - i don't think that's entirely true tbh - during the time in which the majority of famous kabbalists lived (the zohar was completed in the 16th century afaik) women were not considered intelligent enough to study it . the tradition just stuck, and nobody really knows why any more.
the kabbalah and all of those books aren't really considered to have the same validity as say the torah or the talmud, but they are nonetheless part of jewish literature which (if you believe this) is "divinely inspired".
like you said vp, it was about maturity, and if you didn't have enough experience or knowledge, then you couldn't study it, because it contains a lot of esoteric symbolism and stuff which is difficult to understand and rather weird, to be honest, (such as the dimensions of G-d's body!) and so they took the view that if you couldn't handle it it was better not to study it at all...
this of course, led to the view that there must be something sinister about it, which there really isn't, it's just really really "mystical". a lot of kabbalah is simply poetry and prayers and there's nothing odd about it at all - but a lot of it is like ... whoa
however, non-jews did study kabbalah, and these people eventually included a number of christian priests. theres some theory that that's where the illuminati came from but i don't really believe it
the kabbalah and all of those books aren't really considered to have the same validity as say the torah or the talmud, but they are nonetheless part of jewish literature which (if you believe this) is "divinely inspired".
like you said vp, it was about maturity, and if you didn't have enough experience or knowledge, then you couldn't study it, because it contains a lot of esoteric symbolism and stuff which is difficult to understand and rather weird, to be honest, (such as the dimensions of G-d's body!) and so they took the view that if you couldn't handle it it was better not to study it at all...
this of course, led to the view that there must be something sinister about it, which there really isn't, it's just really really "mystical". a lot of kabbalah is simply poetry and prayers and there's nothing odd about it at all - but a lot of it is like ... whoa
however, non-jews did study kabbalah, and these people eventually included a number of christian priests. theres some theory that that's where the illuminati came from but i don't really believe it
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
because you are thrownign accuseations around like confettii that no one but you is doing a damn thing to resolve the current situation, which then begs the question aye and what is it that you are doing??astronaut said:
Has to be said...
Nino: Why is it that you very, very rarely talk about the subject of a thread. In the past two days I have seen your posts, question my identity, my age, my religious habits, and screen name [among other things] and not one post about the subjects. This seems to be a huge problem for you. Here, I will help you Nino. You obviously know that there is a personal messaging system here so why do we not try this: Next time you find yourself obsessed over me, simply message me OFFTHREAD and we can leave the others to their discourse since it seems to bore you so much. By the way, I have never claimed to be older than 39. Please provide the post [hoping that this might finally drain your batteries].
Frogwoman: If you have any questions about anything I post, etc., please feel free to question it [preferblly via p.m.]. Also, I want to add that it seems as if you think I have said my dad was in the camps, I actually said "his generation." My dad was from Syria so he did not have to deal with that but my mom's family [from Moldova] sadly did.
Jonti: Yes, "We are the World" was a catchy tune but worthless in reality. Like it or not, people cling to nationalism and I for one do see its relevance. Jews ARe a dsitinct people and this is a fact. The statement is true.
IROBOT: Yes, the reason is because it is deep that one can go insane studying it [not a meant to be a joke]. The male over the female is thus: Men and woman are equal before the Creator but both are imbued with different responsibilities. Women are considered to have been tasked with the greater role in that they are the foundation of the home. this is represented in our practice of matrilineal descent. Men on the other hand are required to pray 3 times a day and to uphold all ov the commandments [there are 613, not just 10]. Thus man is tasked with the greater religious responsibility andis therefore better equipped to deal with the deep foundation atop which Kabbalah rests.
The age of 40 is very old in tradtional circles, most tradtional men
well on the way to great grandfatherhood by this time. this maturity enables one to deal with the great moral choices one faces when dealing with Kabbalah.
The purpose of bening thoroughly acquainted with Scripture is to offer the student I] the neccessary Scriptural foundation so that he may have at least a chance of understanding even a tiny portion of it...and II] mastering this huge amount of Scipture is incredibly time consuming, thus forcing the student to take the neccessary time [until age 40] before undertaking his study of Kabbalh.
Panda: Women do not contaminate anything unless they are mensturating or in childbirth abnd shortly thereafter. The reasons are listed above.
As for women studying it, perhaps it might have happned but a woman doing that in a traditional community would most likely have been killed so it is rather unlikely that it happaned on anything more than a rare case scenario.
Nino: Why is it that you very, very rarely talk about the subject of a thread. In the past two days I have seen your posts, question my identity, my age, my religious habits, and screen name [among other things] and not one post about the subjects. This seems to be a huge problem for you. Here, I will help you Nino. You obviously know that there is a personal messaging system here so why do we not try this: Next time you find yourself obsessed over me, simply message me OFFTHREAD and we can leave the others to their discourse since it seems to bore you so much. By the way, I have never claimed to be older than 39. Please provide the post [hoping that this might finally drain your batteries].
Frogwoman: If you have any questions about anything I post, etc., please feel free to question it [preferblly via p.m.]. Also, I want to add that it seems as if you think I have said my dad was in the camps, I actually said "his generation." My dad was from Syria so he did not have to deal with that but my mom's family [from Moldova] sadly did.
Jonti: Yes, "We are the World" was a catchy tune but worthless in reality. Like it or not, people cling to nationalism and I for one do see its relevance. Jews ARe a dsitinct people and this is a fact. The statement is true.
IROBOT: Yes, the reason is because it is deep that one can go insane studying it [not a meant to be a joke]. The male over the female is thus: Men and woman are equal before the Creator but both are imbued with different responsibilities. Women are considered to have been tasked with the greater role in that they are the foundation of the home. this is represented in our practice of matrilineal descent. Men on the other hand are required to pray 3 times a day and to uphold all ov the commandments [there are 613, not just 10]. Thus man is tasked with the greater religious responsibility andis therefore better equipped to deal with the deep foundation atop which Kabbalah rests.
The age of 40 is very old in tradtional circles, most tradtional men
well on the way to great grandfatherhood by this time. this maturity enables one to deal with the great moral choices one faces when dealing with Kabbalah.
The purpose of bening thoroughly acquainted with Scripture is to offer the student I] the neccessary Scriptural foundation so that he may have at least a chance of understanding even a tiny portion of it...and II] mastering this huge amount of Scipture is incredibly time consuming, thus forcing the student to take the neccessary time [until age 40] before undertaking his study of Kabbalh.
Panda: Women do not contaminate anything unless they are mensturating or in childbirth abnd shortly thereafter. The reasons are listed above.
As for women studying it, perhaps it might have happned but a woman doing that in a traditional community would most likely have been killed so it is rather unlikely that it happaned on anything more than a rare case scenario.
More...
Forgwoman: The Zohar was completed in the 1200s by Moises DeLeon in Spain but he actually claimed it was written in the 100s during the war with Rome. Kabbalah began to take shape however during the second Babylonian Exile.
It has nothing to do with women's general intelligence.
Quite right that there were priests and monks that did study it.
Forgwoman: The Zohar was completed in the 1200s by Moises DeLeon in Spain but he actually claimed it was written in the 100s during the war with Rome. Kabbalah began to take shape however during the second Babylonian Exile.
It has nothing to do with women's general intelligence.
Quite right that there were priests and monks that did study it.
tangentlama
Nameless voices crying
astronaut said:
ignore him for a while, Garf. just don't reply to him unless he can actually make a contribution to the forum. very little has come from his interjections, but if he made any good posts, they've been overshadowed by his bullshit, and there are far more important things to talk about.
just lay off the tit-for-tat, and don't respond (Newton's 3rd Law of motion - "For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction."
(1,000th post - place marker for a relevant post, which would be 'nice' for a change!)
(am coming back to re-edit this into a better post).
astronaut=troll=bin/ban - no-one calls a peacenik 'an extremist' unless they're working against the People's efforts for peace - such a viewpoints appear unable to comprehend the multi-faceted complexity, and take a reductive, simplistic approach, which only exacerbates the attempts being made in this forum to discuss the issues in the presence of many representational viewpoints.
we simply COULD NOT sit together at this point in the same room as each other to discuss some of these things at present, mainly because their is a no-platform on meeting 'the other side', enforceable by law, but discussions in this open forum is the next best thing
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Well, that's where you are wrong, pal. You have been inconsistent in many areas - including your 'background'. If it is one thing I truly hate it is liars. All I have seen you do is twist other people's words and make thinly veiled racist remarks that are based on your cultural relativism.
I won't be sending you a pm, why on earth would I want to encourage such a vile racist like you?
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