Best Spike Lee Film
- Thread starter Madusa
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Leica said:
definitely my next favourite. Totally under-rated movie
ska invita
back on the other side
Im a big fan of Spike Lee - what i like about his films is that he never makes it easy - in fact I think he sometimes practices deliberate reverse racism just to piss (white) people off and let them know what it feels like!
Sometimes he overdoes trying to make overly positive architypes, but despite the flaws his films are always rivetting and thought provoking (apart from She Hate Me!).
I like how there is often a mixed message, both moral and social - lots of grey area - which particularly works in films about race (grey being where black and white meet)
It's great to see that he keeps on making films and keeps on taking on interesting projects. He reminds of WOody Allen like that - pure film maker. Just like Woody Allen I haven;t got a favourite. FOr what its worth here's what I think of the ones I've seen:
Sometimes he overdoes trying to make overly positive architypes, but despite the flaws his films are always rivetting and thought provoking (apart from She Hate Me!).
I like how there is often a mixed message, both moral and social - lots of grey area - which particularly works in films about race (grey being where black and white meet)
It's great to see that he keeps on making films and keeps on taking on interesting projects. He reminds of WOody Allen like that - pure film maker. Just like Woody Allen I haven;t got a favourite. FOr what its worth here's what I think of the ones I've seen:
- She's Gotta Have It - purest Spike.
- Do The Right Thing - classic.
- School Daze - the most out there, surreal Spike film - love this. Makes a great document of late80's/early 90's fashion/culture, maybe even more so than DTRT. Made me scared of the US school system - particlarly the frat house stuff.
- Mo' Better Blues - Love the sound track, but lots of weaknesses, particularly unrealistic portrayals of lifestyles. too stylised for me.
- Jungle Fever - brave go at tackling a tricky theme, Samuel L. Jackson as a crack addict is laughable.
- Malcolm X - this was brilliant, and is much overlooked - Denzel was robbed of an Oscar for this.
- Crooklyn - the acting of the little girl in this is brilliant, but similiar flaws to Mo Better Blues. Also that opening crane shot over a tree in Brooklyn is just played out by this stage - stylisticaly too much like DTRT, MBB and JF. It moved me though.
- Clockers - read the book and so didnt really like the film. Great book!
- Girl 6 - Didn't get it at the time, but would like to see it again.
- Get on the Bus - the most interseting/analytical Spike film since Do THe Right THing that I've seen.
- Bamboozeled - has that hallmark uncomfortable feeling to watch as Spike confronts racism in the media. thought provoking
- She Hate Me - woops! terrible.
- When the Levees Broke - wish he would do more documentaries - brilliant.
ska invita
back on the other side
The most dissapointing thing about Spike Lee is that there is only Spike Lee out there in US cinema - where are the other african-american directors making african-american films? (anyone know anyone out there making films right now?)
I think SPike got lucky as a window was opened in the late 80's - afrocentrism was the buzz on university campuses - rap was shaking foundations - and Spike Lee praticaly marketed himself into the role of a voice of black america (with a bit of help from Nike!).
That window of opportunity seems to have been shut since then - I think the story about how catwalk models feel that racism in the fashion business is the worst in 20 years has a parallel in film.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/race/story/0,,2153636,00.html
I think its really hard to make films about 'race' (no such thing as race really of course
), particularly in the US, and avoid cliche, moralising, preaching and a number of other pitfalls. I think Spike does carve out new territory.
It would be great if someone else where doing it too.
I think SPike got lucky as a window was opened in the late 80's - afrocentrism was the buzz on university campuses - rap was shaking foundations - and Spike Lee praticaly marketed himself into the role of a voice of black america (with a bit of help from Nike!).
That window of opportunity seems to have been shut since then - I think the story about how catwalk models feel that racism in the fashion business is the worst in 20 years has a parallel in film.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/race/story/0,,2153636,00.html
I can see why some people think his movies are overrated - they dont really have that "classic cinema" sensibility that you might expect from such a famous director - but that's to miss the point of what he's trying to do with film.In Bloom said:
I think its really hard to make films about 'race' (no such thing as race really of course
), particularly in the US, and avoid cliche, moralising, preaching and a number of other pitfalls. I think Spike does carve out new territory.It would be great if someone else where doing it too.
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
Dubversion said:do you? based on what? or - god forbid - is it another JC2 generalisation?
It's the best known, followed maybe by She's Gotta Have It, then Jungle Fever. After that, exposure to his films falls off.
skyscraper101
0891 50 50 50
Bump becaue in case anyone's interested...the next Spike Lee joint is a kickstarter project with about 3 more weeks to run.
I'm going to donate simply because he couldn't have put my thoughts about Hollywood any better:
$10 gets a signed postcard too
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/spikelee/the-newest-hottest-spike-lee-joint
I'm going to donate simply because he couldn't have put my thoughts about Hollywood any better:
$10 gets a signed postcard too
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/spikelee/the-newest-hottest-spike-lee-joint
Johnny Canuck3
Well-Known Member
This thread is so old I was still JC2. 
skyscraper101
0891 50 50 50
Do The Right Thing was ok but I don't particularly like the way the majority of the characters are like send up versions of themselves. I expected better characterisation than just bolshy fight-happy Italian-American pizza boys, angry Korean shop keeper fighting everyone off with a broom, the leery puerto Rican crew, and the overly-angry Radio Raheem (what you don't expect to piss everyone off by blaring Fight the Power 24/7?)
I've seen racism better dealt with in movies made both before and after Do The Right Thing. It was a pioneering movie 'of it's time' sure but I didn't find it particularly Oscar worthy in the grand scheme of things.
I've seen racism better dealt with in movies made both before and after Do The Right Thing. It was a pioneering movie 'of it's time' sure but I didn't find it particularly Oscar worthy in the grand scheme of things.
Lee's list of essential films that his film students should watch.
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/spikelee/the-newest-hottest-spike-lee-joint/posts/550620
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/spikelee/the-newest-hottest-spike-lee-joint/posts/550620
trabuquera
Modesty Bag
Nope. Sorry. Could not disagree more. Do the Right Thing is a masterpiece, Lee's best work, and a cinema milestone. (Though it has great faults.)
There are plenty of great things about DTRT, but the entire POINT of it is that beneath these broad-brush stereotypes (angry black youths, mouthy racist Italians, infiltrating yuppies etc) there are individual people with complex and often conflicting feelings. In fact the drama pointedly makes room for nuance in most (not all) of the characters. Plenty of the script is full of stuff that's not plot-essential just to give more light & shade to the characters (i.e. the touching old couple, Sal and Pino's difficult relationship as brothers, Mookie's domestic entanglements and irresponsibility, etc.) The whole direction of the drama is that given how easily things can escalate on a hot day in NYC when people of different races/backgrounds rub up against each other, those personal relationships can fall away and people reach back to their stereotypes rather than dealing with individuals.
It also looks astonishing and is visually bold and poetic - and often quite artificially themed/filtered/set-dressed to make a point, in a flamboyant and graphic way which wasn't that common in film at that time and is still not often pushed to the max today. A lot of Spike Lee's work is sloppy and un-thought-out but definitely not in the visual sense. You can take it or leave it but he does have a signature pictorial style which is distinctive and was (at the time) innovative.
The soundtrack is still great and overall the whole thing has an energy and verve which are all too rare in films even today (TWENTY FOUR YEARS LATER, my God) which have been chewing up and reusing many Spike Lee tricks for ages.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
mm, bloody good list. I haven't seen Killer of Sheep, The Last Detail, The Train, Fat City, Home of the Brave, Coolie High, Is Paris Burning, Kung Fu Hustle, or Miracle in Milan, so I think I'll have to chase those up if they're half as good as everything else on that list.
skyscraper101
0891 50 50 50
But why have broad brush stereotypes at all? Everyone's got their front facing persona, and their complex demons within. He didn't need to play up that level of front to the nth degree. The entire message behind that story could've been achieved without having to play on exaggerated clichés to make the wider point. It insults the intelligence of the audience to think that we wouldn't get it otherwise. I half expected Mickey Rooney's bucktoothed Japanese character to make a cameo screaming to keep the noise down at one point.
On your other points about the set dress, non essential characters, neighbourhood encroachment by yuppies/new business, soundtrack, filters and pictorial style etc etc - I completely agree. He got it near perfect, which is why for me its even more of a shame that those characters take some of the shine off what should be a complete masterpiece.
trabuquera
Modesty Bag
Remember that this film was made for Americans.
And In 1989 , when a lot of the media "hip hop revolution" - which Lee himself did so much to promote, and jump on, and make happen - hadn't happened yet, when 'the whole world' hadn't yet decided to dance to rap, when Jay Z and Beyonce and world-spanning dominant Black celebs had been barely dreamed of outside of sports, when the Def Jam sound was (or was perceived as) still being a revolutionary newish thing etc. A lot of the audience for the film - maybe even the majority of it - still DID live by stereotype and those who didn't would not have the same views on race as the average US audience today.In fact IIRC the film was made partly as a reaction to anti-Black hate crimes in Howard Beach (all the way back in 1986!) and elsewhere so the timeline is long on this one.
And: just a thought: the Trayvon Martin case shows, if anything, that "the audience" in general - the US public - still has plenty of broad-brush stereotypes very much on its mind.
(btw I am not trying to pursue a feud with you here - genuinely trying to figure out what it is that did or didn't work in the film, for me and/or for anyone else.)
skyscraper101
0891 50 50 50
Remember that this film was made for Americans.
In fact IIRC the film was made partly as a reaction to anti-Black hate crimes in Howard Beach (all the way back in 1986!) and elsewhere so the timeline is long on this one.
And: just a thought: the Trayvon Martin case shows, if anything, that "the audience" in general - the US public - still has plenty of broad-brush stereotypes very much on its mind.
(btw I am not trying to pursue a feud with you here - genuinely trying to figure out what it is that did or didn't work in the film, for me and/or for anyone else.)
Yeah I know.
Perhaps I should allow Spike a bit of Leeway re: the 80s US audience. Obviously I'm speaking for myself from this semi-enlightened time but I'd like to think that if anyone came along these days and tried to portray those characters in such a way, they should be taken to task for it.
FWIW, I enjoyed 'She's Gotta Have It' a lot more because I found the characters a lot more real. I also rather enjoyed one of his most recent movies 'Red Hook Summer' (Lee makes a couple of brief appearances delivering pizzas reprising his role of Mookie ftw)
youngian
Well-Known Member
I find it hard to believe he can't find a backer for a documentary so what he was doing on Newsnight pan handling a crowdsourcing pitch for a vampire film is anyones guess.
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