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Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action

Discussion in 'UK politics, current affairs and news' started by cogg, May 24, 2010.

  1. bignose1

    bignose1 Searchlight Spoiler

    Think it was whe she was living in Acton..ground floor flat....Was when I was training up a few people in the early 90's and we'd do some mock surveillance exercises...good fun.
  2. bignose1

    bignose1 Searchlight Spoiler

    Couldnt have been Acton...thats not 'central' ( or is it ) Anyway quite posh...but cat shit city....never pleasant anyway. Same with Jonesy up in AUL...his moggy could well pooh for engerrrrlanddd.
  3. bignose1

    bignose1 Searchlight Spoiler

    It was Earls Court Ive been reminded.....
  4. audiotech

    audiotech wav, aiff, mp3, ogg, flac

    The Dowager herself. A real nasty piece of work.

  5. SpineyNorman

    SpineyNorman it was already like that when I got here

    I'd stick it up anyway mate. You've acknowledged yourself that you think it's not perfect and I think everyone realises you're not intentionally misrepresenting anything - I reckon any criticism you got, on here at least, would be constructive - nobody's gonna act the cunt. And it can't be all that bad if you got a first for it!
    malatesta32 likes this.
  6. The39thStep

    The39thStep Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbour?

    I bumped into her and two other old folk giving out some racist and anti semitic leaflets outside Wembley Town Hall in the early 1980s. There was a rumour when she died that she left some of her money to Peter Marriner.
  7. bignose1

    bignose1 Searchlight Spoiler

    Yeah she was an Ipswich fan as well.....
  8. audiotech

    audiotech wav, aiff, mp3, ogg, flac

    Problem solved!

  9. Citizen66

    Citizen66 splash the cistern

    Oh I dunno. Scratch a hippy...
  10. DaveCinzano


    Make sure you're up to date with your shots first.
  11. Red Storm

    Red Storm M14

  12. malatesta32

    malatesta32 Not Serb. No, Really!

    brilliant stuff yet again! thanks loads for all this work. it is most helpful.
  13. The39thStep

    The39thStep Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbour?

    By the time I got to Werhmacht
    They were half a million strong
    Everywhere there was songs and celebration
    And I dreamed I saw the bombers
    Riding shotgun in the sky
    Turning into butterflies
    Above our nation

    We are stardust, we are golden
    And we've got to get ourselves back to the garden
  14. framed

    framed Leave it!

    Seeing that photo of the BM banner reminded me of a mad night in Edinburgh in the mid-1990's when we (Glasgow AFA) were contacted by Edinburgh AFA about a planned BM meeting that they'd been tipped off about. It appeared at the time that this was a move by some of the more militant Nazis to re-organise themselves because of the battering that we were giving the BNP on the streets. This meeting was ostensibly about re-establishing a BM presence in Scotland, but the reality was that AFA was the real reason behind the meeting, so AFA decided to gatecrash it.

    The plan was that we'd allow a fair number of them to gather at the venue and we'd storm it with a strong Scottish AFA mob and beat the fuck out of them, hopefully inflicting such painful memories for them that no-one would ever dare mention the name of the BM in Scotland again.

    Well, that was the plan, and it kinda worked, but there were complications that turned the night into both a battle and a bit of a farce.

    The meeting place organised by Edinburgh AFA was the main arty farty 'world cinema' venue in Edinburgh, which was directly opposite the pub where the fash were meeting. Not only did our lot stick out like sore thumbs in such a place, but the drink was fcuking expensive and there was a lot of time to be killed before the required numbers of fash would appear. We deployed some of our lot in a pub around the corner, but the main body of AFA stayed in the cinema bar.

    We had arrived with a vanload of Celtic casuals and 3 cars filled with other Glasgow AFA activists... The Celtic lads had expected to just jump out of the van and straight into a fight, so they'd obviously stocked up on their 'carry out' for the one hour journey to Edinburgh. By the time they got there, they were already 'happy' and in the mood for a barney. I had to spend a bit of time convincing them that there was no point storming the venue at that moment cos it was almost empty apart from a couple of fash and a 'kissing couple' who were AFA members placed in the pub and who would give us the signal when the time was right for the attack.

    We had arrived early and the AFA members from Glasgow and Edinburgh generally knew the script, go easy on the beers (preferably don't drink any alcohol at all) and remain disciplined so as not to attract any unwanted attention from the police or the nice middle class people in the Cinema's bar, where we had gathered.

    After about an hour of waiting, the Celtic lads started getting itchy feet, complaining about the price of beer in the posh bar. Some wandered off in search of an off-license to buy some cans, whilst others just started to wander up and down the road outside, which wasn't part of the plan. The Celtic bhoys on the street saw a group of about 8 fash enter the venue, which was more than enough in their opinion and, as we watched from the bar across the road, we suddenly saw a group of CSC (Celtic Soccer Crew) attempt to storm the pub without the rest of us. There was a fight at the door before the lads broke through. One of the senior Edinburgh AFA members asks me, what the fuck are they doing? I replied that it was fucking madness but that we'd have to do it now because the original plan had just been completely fucked up by the drunken over-enthusiasm of the casuals.

    Anyway, we all make a bee-line for the venue from which the fash had started fleeing in terror from the Celtic casuals who'd broken into their gathering. This meant that we were able to pick a few off as they came out of the door of the pub. At one point I think there were two or three fash running a gauntlet of about 30 AFA and just being kicked and punched all over the place. Others had been battered inside the pub and got battered again as they tried to escape into the street.

    In a comedy moment, Big Al, one of the Glasgow AFA members, knowing the numbers to be overkill, is still standing watching events from the other side of the road, when he signals to me and starts pointing at a telephone box and smiling. I looked over and there's a big bonehead, who had obviously been on his way to the meeting, inside the telephone box either making a phonecall for reinforcements, or pretending to make one in the hope that he will be rendered invisible to us. I just happened to have in my pocket some of the strongest CS gas spray that we'd ever got hold of, so I sauntered over to the phone box and Big Al politely opens the door for me. At this point the bonehead snarls something about 'trying to make a call', which was answered with a full spray of CS gas in eyes, nose and throat. He just collapsed in a heap and was stamped on by me and Big Al. Then we shut the door of the phone box and left him there, curled up in the foetal position.

    Meanwhile, another mad situation had developed between one of the Celtic boys and a member of Edinburgh AFA. This was the fella who'd been our 'eyes and ears' inside the pub, along with a young woman AFA member. When it kicked off inside the pub, the Celtic lads had basically attacked everyone in there, believing them to be part of the BM group. The young Edinburgh AFA lad was also a Hibs Casual and when a couple of the Celtic boys had gone for him, he'd produced a cosh and given one of them it over the head, before explaining to him that he was also with AFA. The Celtic lad, being slightly concussed, bleeding and drunk, was furious and kept trying to take revenge on the Hibs lad, slabbering about how "we can't trust these Hibs bastards!" Eventually that situation was defused, but it took a while to calm things down. It was our 'friendly fire' moment.

    On the whole it was a victory; the BM had tried to meet and organise themselves into a fighting unit to take on AFA, we'd nipped them in the bud and we never heard of the BM trying to organise themselves in Scotland again after that night, but fuck me we didn't half make it hard for ourselves.

  15. Red Storm

    Red Storm M14

    Quiet a massive update to the archive has gone up.

    More will be added over the weekend so keep an eye out on Weekly Update 10.
    Deareg, malatesta32 and bignose1 like this.
  16. malatesta32

    malatesta32 Not Serb. No, Really!

    great stuff. thanks loads!
  17. malatesta32

    malatesta32 Not Serb. No, Really!

  18. Red Storm

    Red Storm M14

    I don't think there is much to clarify.

    Its a SF event not a 32CSM event. Its clearly a response to being attack at their march the other month.

    The Infidels seem to be wanting to make a link with the movements in the past and show themselves to be more hardline and in the tradition of the nationalist movements of the 80s and 90s than the EDL. Thats why I think they've gone off on this anti-Irish tangent.

    A small potatoes methinks.
    Nigel likes this.
  19. malatesta32

    malatesta32 Not Serb. No, Really!

    ha ha yes, theyre as confused over irish politics as they are about the opposition to their own pitiful demos. to be fair it's pretty complex - been writing about blueshirts and IRA etc meself! Crivvens!. the infidels are pretty much NF and therefore into that daft loyalism stuff.
  20. intersol32

    intersol32 Well-Known Member

    From what I can tell the event is being organised by the James Larkin Society and the Trade Unions. It's a commemoration that's taken place for some years, and this year will focus on racism and fascism due to the recent attacks by fascists on people and property.

    I'm not really paying much attention to the usual Indymedia comments, as it's mostly posted up there by either whackos or far-right mixers.

    I'd view this event in a similar manner to the Bloody Sunday commemorations of the past, and the Fash are probably looking at it in a similar manner. This means it'll be fraught with many of the same difficulties no doubt.

    Firstly, the cops are likely to be watching the situation closely especially since the NWI etc have been flyposting around it and portraying it as "an IRA March". I'm guessing they'll hope to whip up interest from the Liverpool Loyalist bands, football casuals, EDL types, ex-servicemen and followers in a hope of boosting their numbers. With this in mind (and if it's like the Sean Phelan march) it won't take many to block a road or two and get the cops to reroute it or cancel the thing in the name of public safety.

    In the next instance, where its perfectly within anyone's right to turn up and join the march, the notion that carrying a few banners, wearing masks and trying to form another 'blac bloc' will prevent or discourage fascists from having a go is naive in the extreme. In fact it's more likely to attract further police attention and either get people nicked, or kettled (as happened in Bolton etc).

    It has to be mentioned again, that the only course of effective action surrounding this and other events is to discreetly organise mobile stewards groups away from the march but who can intervene in a physical manner should it be deemed necessary.
  21. framed

    framed Leave it!

    IMHO, anti-fascists should be wary of Irish republicans setting the political agenda for them, and I say that as a long standing supporter of Irish republicanism and anti-fascism.

    The previous march organised by the James Larkin Society/Liverpool Irish Patriots RFB was a red rag to a bull. It was not an 'Irish community event' as has been claimed, it was quite clearly an Irish Republican event to commemorate an obscure IRA volunteer, Sean Phelan from Liverpool, who fought in the war of independence. To try to force a march like that, which did nothing for community relations in Liverpool, through the city centre in the same period as the fascists were regularly picketing the Rochdale Nonces Trial was absolutely stupid imho. It simply gave the fash another focal point and they used their new-found unity around the court pickets to build a mob that could block and delay the republican march. In that sense they were right to describe the Sean Phelan Commemoration as a republican 'IRA march' (sic) because that is exactly what it was...

    You have to question the political wisdom of organising a march in commemoration of an obscure IRA volunteer (just because he was born in LIverpool) at a time when it is fairly obvious that Sinn Fein, the republican 'wing' to which the JLS and Liverpool Irish Patriots are affiliated, is increasingly moving away from such overt displays of support for Irish republican militarism, past and present.

    Even if the JLS and the LIPRFB were not affiliated to Sinn Fein, I would still question whether that march was appropriate for any city in England at this time, regardless of which side you take in relation to the GFA and SF's holy grail of the never ending 'peace process'.

    The situation now is that the fash have been emboldened by their relative success last time around and are organising against next Saturday's march, which has been conveniently tagged as being a march 'against racism and fascism' by the organisers.

    I believe that republicans need to take stock and consider the consequences of their actions and whether or not they are seriously contributing anything to the fight against racism and fascism by marching for marching's sake.

    If the real effect of our actions is to provide a focal point around which the fascists can build - at a time when there is no discernable political advantage to be gained by republicans from such marches - then I believe the republican strategy for marches in England (if it can be called a strategy) to be politically counter-productive.

    BTW, the above post (link) on the Liverpool AF blog is as disingenuous as it is dishonest in trying to play down the connections between an Irish republican flute band and Irish republican militarism.

    "Fascists from North West Infidels, Combined Ex-Forces and Casuals United are already talking big about stopping the Flute Band from marching – and are trying to pin the “IRA” label on them, even though the band have nothing in common with the long officially disarmed paramilitary group."

    "nothing in common" [​IMG] Are you being serious?

    FFS, who are you trying to kid - yourselves? [​IMG]

    That type of thoroughly dishonest statement does nothing for the political credibility of republicans and anti-fascists.
  22. Red Storm

    Red Storm M14

    Interesting points.

    I have been in between whether it was a cultural event or if it was purely a militarist event. I think arguments can be made for either side, however, to what extent the Liverpool Irish community comes out for the event has appeared minimal to me.
  23. intersol32

    intersol32 Well-Known Member

    I'd pretty much agree with the above assessment.

    It would appear at times that the intention of having a couple of RFB's marching through the city is a way of laying down a challenge to the Fascists for attacking the previous event. Going a bit further than 'framed' I'd say that if this is the case it's actually allowing the initiative to be passed over to the Fascists themselves. As an old AFA comrade said to me once; "fight them on your own terms...not theirs". It would almost seem that this event may be in the latter category.

    As another long time supporter of the Irish Republican Movement I can understand how members of the Irish Community in Britain feel the necessity to commemorate individuals and events. However, there's sometimes a tendency to ignore the fact that this is indeed Britain, and not the occupied Six Counties. Commemorations and marches have to be balanced with certain sensitivities and carried out in a dignified manner. Otherwise to many onlookers it can just reaffirm the stereotypes of Orange/Green or Catholic/Protestant tribalism.

    From an Anti-Fascist perspective I'd say that the emphasis has to be placed on the surrounding Fascist activity. I doubt if any effective physical opposition would be forthcoming from the actual organizers of the event, and lessons from the past have shown that it's the very same people from the Trade Union Movement and PSF who actually condemned such actions for "attracting trouble" even when it was militant Anti-Fascists who saved their necks on the day.

    Again, anyone attending should be cautious and discreet.
  24. framed

    framed Leave it!

    ON the issue of cultural/political raised by RS, the question that should be put to the organisers of the Sean Phelan Commemoration is why did Sean Phelan have to be remembered with a march through Liverpool city centre fronted by flute bands in militaristic uniforms?

    Why not a meeting, rally, gig (or combination of all three) to discuss Sean Phelan's life and political contribution?

    The reality (as Intersol implies is the case with Saturday's march) is that the people who organised the event were throwing down the gauntlet to anyone who cared to oppose them and, to be frank, this has increasingly become the M.O. of this group and other former (P)IRA militarist groupies who have been left high and dry by the political turn of SF, but who have not broken with that organisation and its support groups over here.

    I should point out that 3 or 4 years ago it was only the representations that I made to the Cairde organiser in Scotland and the direct intervention of myself and a couple of former AFA/Squad members from Manchester that prevented this same group from Liverpool applying for permission to relaunch the Manchester Martyrs Commemoration by means of a route that would have been suicidal for republicans and anti-fascists. What was their political reasoning then? They had none, other than that they should have the right to march wherever they liked and commemorate whoever and whatever they wanted to...

    Make no bones about it, Sinn Fein would cut the flute bands adrift were it not for their paranoia that those who previously worshiped the military struggle of the provos might go over to the dreaded 'dissidents'. Instead of cutting them off, they patronise them by involving them in meaningless fundraising activities (for a political party that is awash with money) and allowing them to indulge their penchant for marching in musical time through English and Scottish towns.

    I am not against commemorations and marches, but there's a time to march and there's a time to stand back and take stock politically.
  25. framed

    framed Leave it!

    A further heads-up on this march. Going by some of the posts made by its organisers on the Cairde Bands page, they are proudly boasting of passing all fascist and loyalist threats made against Saturday's march to the police, with whom they appear to be in regular contact and fully co-operating, in keeping with Cairde and Sinn Fein policy.

    This should be borne in mind by any militant anti-fascists who intend to be in Liverpool this Saturday. The march will be stewarded by the police, the Cairde stewards will be there to co-operate with the police and keep order on the march, do not expect them to co-operate with militant anti-fascists, on or off the march.
    Smokeandsteam and fiannanahalba like this.
  26. malatesta32

    malatesta32 Not Serb. No, Really!

    framed likes this.
  27. framed

    framed Leave it!

    I was tempted to contribute but thought better of it... I made the same points that I made here yesterday on the AFA Ireland facebook page regarding the James Larkin 'anti-racist' march and I can assure you that there are 'fuckbugles' on each side who are intent on pursuing their own selfish little agendas at the expense of working class unity in Liverpool.

    Supporters of mainstream Irish republicanism over here have no strategy with regard to their own movement and its aims (which appear to be ever changing) and imho they have no strategy and little to contribute to the fight against racism and fascism, especially as they folow a liberal anti-racist agenda that includes (bizarrely imho) appeals to the British state to protect and steward their marches. This is entirely in keeping with Sinn Fein's new found respect for the police and other state institutions.

    If further proof were needed of the liberal pro-state approach, Saturday's event includes two supporters of Searchlight on the platform of speakers.

    BTW, just a suggestion, but shouldn't these posts on Liverpool be on a thread of their own, or is it ok to continue with this discussion on the BTF thread?
  28. malatesta32

    malatesta32 Not Serb. No, Really!

    it's all part of the same struggle man!
    framed likes this.
  29. malatesta32

    malatesta32 Not Serb. No, Really!

    as sol said earlier:
    'It has to be mentioned again, that the only course of effective action surrounding this and other events is to discreetly organise mobile stewards groups away from the march but who can intervene in a physical manner should it be deemed necessary.'
    walking alongside demos means quickly avoiding kettles and being able to breakaway from the main body without being impeded in small groups. im not au fait with the intricacies of republican groups but i would strongly reccomend what framed said above:
    'The march will be stewarded by the police, the Cairde stewards will be there to co-operate with the police and keep order on the march, do not expect them to co-operate with militant anti-fascists, on or off the march.'
    keep your own council. antifascists attending are not there to support republicans but to act as an antifascist presence in response to a fascist threat. like we are not there to 'protect muslims.'
    intersol32, fiannanahalba and framed like this.
  30. malatesta32

    malatesta32 Not Serb. No, Really!

    and maybe a thread on this would be good cos theres gonna be a lot of tweets, texts and emails flying about on saturday. i will contact liverAF again.
    framed likes this.

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