Battle for Brixton 1981

[Mr Retro]

I agree about the former commander William. Do you think because he made 2 horrendous errors of judgement in the space of 24 hours he feels he simply can't back down and admit he was wrong (as well as racist)?

I was pissing myself at Whitelaw (what an unfortunate name to visit Brixton with after the riot ) and the crowd shouting and jeering at him. He looked ready to shit himself.

At least he did something about it though by ordering the enquiry.

Did the program makers include bits of Thatcher speaking over the pictures to irritate and anger the viewers? If so it fucking worked for me. Evil cunt.

 

[BrixiSteve]

Oh, no, bollox, I missed it. Been looking forward to it for ages. Sounds great from what I've been told. Any of you lot know if it's going to be on repeat at all. I really hope so

 

[wiskey]

i watched it and as others have said i thought it was quite fair. i found it really interesting.

i wasnt able to record it though so if it is on again i'd like to know.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

what's that?

If you have a video that can video plus, you look at those little numbers that are listed next to the programme and you enter them and it does the rest for you. Saves all that farting about with entering start/finish times etc.

 

[wiskey]

i must admit i'm stunned so many people still use video

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

I wasn't expecting the frankness of those interviewed.

I was giggling at the "we all had new suits and champagne"

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

i must admit i'm stunned so many people still use video

why?

 

[Crispy]

Cos us coool people download all our TV these days

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Cos us coool people download all our TV these days

I don't have a computer

 

[Crispy]

I don't have a computer

*imagines Minnie vigorously semaphoring urban posts to Editor, who's standing on the barrier block with a pair of binoculars looking for incoming messages*

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

*imagines Minnie vigorously semaphoring urban posts to Editor, who's standing on the barrier block with a pair of binoculars looking for incoming messages*

I meant at home

 

[john x]

and that was a good feeling, gave a pretty good idea of how how feelings were running at the time.

The programme got the vibe right. There was a definite atmosphere of celebration among the madness. As well as one of "Well they can beat us and fit us up 363 days of the year but at least for these two days we can at least hit back at them a little".

The cops in Brixton are shit now but the programme did remind you that in 1981 they were a bunch to total corrupt violent bastards.

re. the law, I would not advise anyone on here to start telling tales of what they did in the riots. (81 and 85) Save it for the pub.

And didn't we look 'old fashioned' in those days?

john x

 

[Stobart Stopper]

Nasty letter about Brian's contribution in today's Evening Standard.

 

[tommers]

I saw it. Thought it was good. Started off quite pro-rioter, with all the stories about police assualts, evidence planting, the old commissioner going on about how "blacks are criminals" etc.

Then I thought it swung around once the riots started and showed more of the police viewpoint, that they were underprepared and facing petrol bombs, bricks and large mobs of angry people. When the old policeman was going on about how he was in a line with shields he had never used before, flanked by WPCs and traffic cops and with burning petrol coming up over his legs his eyes got a bit watery and I thought "yeah, that must have been f**king scary".

I thought it did a good job of showing both sides and explaining the causes of what happened.

 

[STFC]

Not sure why Onket's getting agitated. A few interviewees were admitting to chucking bricks and chucking petrol bombs but why did they do it? Because they were caught up in the anger and chaos of the time. That bloke who said that for once, after years and years of being harassed and hassled by coppers in their face all the time, they were able to fight them back and get away with it, and that was a good feeling, gave a pretty good idea of how how feelings were running at the time.

Would agree with that to an extent William. However, one of the main contributors (can't remember his name) was basically angry because he couldn't go about his business with getting hassled by coppers - then he admitted that his business was selling drugs! Couldn't help the feeling that as well as being a reaction to the obvious injustices being meted out by the Met at the time, some people just wanted to keep Railton Road as a no-go area for the old bill. I'm sure other residents were concerned about the level of crime in the area, even if they didn't agree with the methods employed to combat it.

 

[William of Walworth]

Nasty letter about Brian's contribution in today's Evening Standard.

Would like to know what it says ...

 

[William of Walworth]

Would agree with that to an extent William. However, one of the main contributors (can't remember his name) was basically angry because he couldn't go about his business with getting hassled by coppers - then he admitted that his business was selling drugs! Couldn't help the feeling that as well as being a reaction to the obvious injustices being meted out by the Met at the time, some people just wanted to keep Railton Road as a no-go area for the old bill. I'm sure other residents were concerned about the level of crime in the area, even if they didn't agree with the methods employed to combat it.

I'll leave others more qualified to respond properly to that, but I'd have thought most of the anger arose from the indiscriminite targetting of any and every black youth ...

 

[Stobart Stopper]

Would like to know what it says ...

Here it is:

"It's Criminal To Blame The Police:

Does Met Police Commissioner Sir Ian Blair have any credibily left?
Let us hope, if he is forced out, he is not replaced by his deputy, Brian Paddick, pioneer of the softly-softly approach to cannabis, who has proclaimed that the Brixton riots were all the fault of the police.
As Brixton resident, I believe this is a shameless rewriting of history. The police responded to the concerns of residents facing an unprecedented crime wave.
The riots were the work of criminals who could see their control under threat. As a result of the Scarman Inquiry, Brixton has been locked in to ciminality and, regrettably, real institutionalised racism with the total marginalisation of the white population.
Can the Met not agree on one principle; a criminal is a criminal, skin colour has nothing to do with it?

Tom Fawcett, SW9."

 

[Onket]

Not sure why Onket's getting agitated.

I wasn't matey. Just wondered about them admitting things on TV, that's all.

 

[STFC]

I'll leave others more qualified to respond properly to that, but I'd have thought most of the anger arose from the indiscriminite targetting of any and every black youth ...

Those were purely my thoughts as I watched the programme William, I'm not claiming to be an expert on Brixton and the reasons behind the riot.

 

[Brixton Hatter]

"It's Criminal To Blame The Police:

Does Met Police Commissioner Sir Ian Blair have any credibily left?
Let us hope, if he is forced out, he is not replaced by his deputy, Brian Paddick, pioneer of the softly-softly approach to cannabis, who has proclaimed that the Brixton riots were all the fault of the police.
As Brixton resident, I believe this is a shameless rewriting of history. The police responded to the concerns of residents facing an unprecedented crime wave.
The riots were the work of criminals who could see their control under threat. As a result of the Scarman Inquiry, Brixton has been locked in to ciminality and, regrettably, real institutionalised racism with the total marginalisation of the white population.
Can the Met not agree on one principle; a criminal is a criminal, skin colour has nothing to do with it?

Tom Fawcett, SW9."

x 100!

I'm sure i recognise that name....

 

[William of Walworth]

real institutionalised racism with the total marginalisation of the white population.

HELP HELP -- I'm being marginalised and institutionally disctiminated against ....

 

[e-fluent]

So it wasn't all just about having a night out on looted booze?

 

[William of Walworth]

So it wasn't all just about having a night out on looted booze?

Nah, thats exactly what it was ALL about. The only factor.

 

[Ms T]

Cheers for that Gramsci.

There was also some stuff on radio 4 this morning about the riots - they interviewed various people including that Kwame guy (the playwrite who was in Casualty) who apparently used to live in Brixton. He was talking about the awful atmosphere under the sus laws and how nearly every single black man he knows from the area over the age of 45 (i.e. the young men in Brixton 1981) had been arrested at some time or other under the sus laws. His lowest point personally was walking down the street aged about 12/13 to be kicked in the back by a copper who said "give me a reason to arrest you n****r." His point was that this wasn't simply a random flashpoint on a hot saturday, but something that had been built up by the police and society for some time.

I heard that too -- and didn't think much of it. Kwame thingammy bob isn't even from Brixton, he's from Southall, and Linda Bellos isn't from Brixton either. I thought it was a bit of a missed opportunity to discuss more interesting things, like why 25 years on young black men in Brixton and other inner city area are being shot on a regular basis because they see drug-dealing as their only opportunity.

 

[Ms T]

I saw two-thirds of the documentary last night and thought it very good. Did get a bit distracted by the fact that our street is in it a lot, as well as the bit of Railton Rd which is just round the corner from our house!

 

[detective-boy]

... why 25 years on young black men in Brixton and other inner city area are being shot on a regular basis because they see drug-dealing as their only opportunity.

In some cases at least you could replace the word "only". With "easiest". Or "quickest". Or "most lucrative". Many of the drug dealers I have dealt with have been anything but incapable of earning an honest living by other means.

 

[timothysutton1]

Could it happen again?

Finally got around to watching the programme. I thought it was very good.

What it didn't ask though was "could it happen again?" With the recent raid on the Fridge and a crack down on drug dealing in Brixton Town Centre certain people might be getting annoyed.

 

[detective-boy]

What it didn't ask though was "could it happen again?" With the recent raid on the Fridge and a crack down on drug dealing in Brixton Town Centre certain people might be getting annoyed.

Although there are a range of opinions in relation to the Fridge (which I think could have been anywhere and the Brixton connection is an accident of geography - it's not as if it's run by Brixton people or is intended to be used primarily by Brixton people), I think there would be FAR more concern from the people who actually live and work in Brixton if there WASN'T a "crack down on drug dealing in Brixton Town Centre".

You suggesting it should be ignored ... or maybe it should be encouraged ...

 

[timothysutton1]

You suggesting it should be ignored? ... or maybe it should be encouraged? ...

Far from it, I am fed up with the effects drug dealing are having in the area and I support the police actions. My question was more theoretical.