"Assaulted" girl hanging by the cash machine at Tesco

Discussion in 'Brixton' started by T & P, Nov 16, 2005.

  1. phildwyer

    phildwyer Gorau arf arf dysg

    William, the reason I took that tone with you is that you began your previous response to me as follows:

    And now, in your recent efforts, you express sympathy for Ismabard's deliberate and shameless distoration of my lynch-mob analogy. Anyway, how about we stop bickering about who's being horrid to whom and address the issues? Please do go through my lengthy response to you, I'd like to see your answers.
  2. phildwyer

    phildwyer Gorau arf arf dysg

    Wanker and desperate liar. As I clearly and unmistakeably say, it is people who advocate vigilante justice against drug dealers in Brixton who resemble the lynch mobs of the American South, not "people who are fed up with street dealers" as you maliciously and falsely claim here.
  3. phildwyer

    phildwyer Gorau arf arf dysg

    What are you talking about? I haven't responded to Pooka yet, except to observe that his points were "excellent" and that I'd get to them later. Which I will. Really, you worry me sometimes...
  4. Crispy

    Crispy The following psytrance is baṉned: All

    I don't much like Phil's style - it's a bit patronising and twisty.

    However, what he has to say about 'unconcious racism' is true - we all have unconcious behaviour patterns that we can't change conciously. If you were brought up in a completely 'white' environment, then people who look 'black' (eg.different) will provoke an unconcious fear of the 'other'. This is normal and it happens to everyone. Because we are civilised people, however, we learn to recognise and control these patterns - and everyone can be friends.

    Just how powerful these unconcous patterns are is up for some serious debate. Freud thought that this was what we were almost completely driven by, with the ego having a shaky hand on the controls. I (like to) think that the rational mind has a firmer grip on things.

    I also think that, although racism is a factor in this issue, it's not a major one. And, given it's subconcious nature, it's not one we can do much about - just be aware of it.

    EDIT : which is kinda what pooka said, now that I've read his post :)
  5. Orang Utan

    Orang Utan razzed up on scrumpy and injustice

    Round of applause for pooka's post!
  6. Isambard

    Isambard Dab of Rioja, Kitten? :D

    I think though Crispy most Urban posters if they had that racist baggage would have done their utmost to dump it eh. And I don't think someone with racist baggae would choose to live in Brixton.
  7. phildwyer

    phildwyer Gorau arf arf dysg

    In order to dump it, they'd first have to become conscious of it. Which means someone would have to point it out to them. Someone like me.
  8. Orang Utan

    Orang Utan razzed up on scrumpy and injustice

    What does racist baggage look like?
  9. Crispy

    Crispy The following psytrance is baṉned: All

    Well, no, I worked it out for myself thanks. And yes, I also have a streak of unconscious racism in me. Through a variety of influences (white, suburban, CofE childhood, mainstream media etc) I have picked up a streak of unconscious racism. However, I understand where it came from and how I can't really erase it, so I let my rational mind kick the shit out of my unconsciousness so that I can be a nice guy.
  10. Isambard

    Isambard Dab of Rioja, Kitten? :D

    I think people can realise they have racist baggage and dump it without necessarily having someone point it out to them. And I think there are better ways of arguing with people carrying soft racist ideas than talking down to them.
  11. RushcroftRoader

    RushcroftRoader Well-Known Member

    Dear Phil,

    Phil, why are you assuming that I am a rascist, despite the fact that you have never met me and know nothing about me - including the colour of my skin. Why do you assume I am white? Have I ever said I am white? No, but you assume my reaction to a skunk dealer was racially motivated. Why? Who is making racial assumptions now?

    Phil, if you are reading this then all I have to say is that I believe you are a genuinely unpleasant and lonely individual.
    Whatever your motives are on posting all this bile, it does not detract from the fact that you are cultivating hate and animosity in what you write.
    I do not have to defend myself to you and have no intention of doing so. Your views mean nothing to me and you are clearly playing some sort of elaborate game with us all. I would not be surprised if this is some sort of controlled experiment.

    I am not going to read this thread again. I think anything of use on this subject has already been said. I recommend everyone do the same.
  12. Crispy

    Crispy The following psytrance is baṉned: All

    It probably is. His Intelligent Design thread was.
  13. Shippou-Sensei

    Shippou-Sensei 4:1:2.5

    probably he comes out with far too many dubious assumptions to take him seriously
  14. ViolentPanda

    ViolentPanda Hardly getting over it.

    Hmmm, abuse and hyperbole in the same post.
  15. ViolentPanda

    ViolentPanda Hardly getting over it.

    Ah yes, because you're so much more socially evolved than everyone else, aren't you Phil?

    Brass neck, no balls AND a massive ego all in the same package. Are you sure you're not Hazel Blears MP?
  16. phildwyer

    phildwyer Gorau arf arf dysg

    It is completely obvious. I could tell you why, but you give the impression that you'd rather I not talk about you any more, and I am quite happy to grant your wish. But it is *completely* obvious.
  17. phildwyer

    phildwyer Gorau arf arf dysg

    To me, it indicates that drug dealing on the street is not a matter for the police. It depends on what you mean by "crime;" certainly no-one would argue that muggers should be tolerated because they come from deprived social circumstances. But simply hustling or higgling is fine, if you ask me. You are right to say that people may have other reasons for not liking being whistled at, followed and so forth, but I believe that unconscious racism is by *far* the most prevelent.

    Perhaps a close second, and related factor, is simple lack of cultural sensitivity. Let me explain a bit further what I mean by that. White, middle-class English people put a higher premium on "personal space" than *any* other group of people in the world. There is *no-one* who dislikes being whistled at, followed, said "skunk" to and so forth more than your average white, middle-class English person. And as we all know, recent years have seem a huge influx of white, middle-class English people into Brixton.

    Once there, their culturally-biased assumptions about "personal space" often collide with those of the established population. I can assure you that, in the working-class streets of Kingston and Lagos, where many residents of Brixton have their roots, a quite different sense of personal space holds sway. The Coldharbour Lane dealers are veritable paragons of restraint and decorum compared to a Jamaican or Nigerian sidewalk vendor on home turf.

    So the question becomes, *whose* set of cultural conventions should be the standard for Brixton? Should the assumptions of white, middle-class English people be imposed on those of other backgrounds? I say "no," and I also say that any argument that it should sails perilously close to racism. Yes, racism.
  18. RushcroftRoader

    RushcroftRoader Well-Known Member

    My father is from Mayalsia and my mother is from Ireland although she was born in Singapore.

  19. toggle

    toggle wobbly

    :D :D ;)
  20. phildwyer

    phildwyer Gorau arf arf dysg

    I'm afraid that doesn't get us very far. Both Malaysians and Irish can be of any race, and any skin colour. What do you *look* like, that is the point. Well?
  21. brix

    brix spinster of this parish

    Oh for pity's sake... :rolleyes:
  22. pooka

    pooka Can't Re Member

    A disappinting response, phil. You're just reiterating your original assertions and haven't addressed the points I've made. I demonstrated that a strong reaction to aggressive street dealing in illegal drugs (ie a criminal activity, and one who's obviousness declares 'the law doesn't operate here') goes across the board, acknowledging that different parts of the community will have different nuances to that reaction.

    You've responded with the same old obsession with white middle class norms of personal space. You've also suggested that this is due to a sudden influx of middle-class whites...not so, that's been happing since the squatters first arrived in the 70's.

    You ask what norms should apply in Brixton? Clearly the ones that the majority of people who live there, work there, come there to enjoy themselves or are just passing though subscribe to. And those norms most certainly don't include aggressive selling of illegal drugs. If you reckon they do, from your vantage thousands of miles away, then you're talking out of your bum, or would be if you had one!

    "To me, it indicates that drug dealing on the street is not a matter for the police." Next time you're over, try that line out on Pastor Chris Andre Watson or Ros Griffiths and also the notion that it's only middle class whites who are annoyed by street dealers. See what reaction you get. (The article is from the NY Times, so the spelling will be comfortable for you)
  23. TeeJay

    TeeJay New Member

    When did you visit Lagos? I didn't get harassed by "sidewalk vendors" when I was there in 1990, in the same way as I do by scammers and dealers on CHL.
  24. TeeJay

    TeeJay New Member

    You said you knew that he was white and that it was completely obvious. In other words you are a stupid cunt.
  25. linerider

    linerider Funk Soul Bother

    but it was completely obvious that he was a stupid cunt
  26. Jessiedog

    Jessiedog Keeping the faith.

    Well, how's about this?

    If every skunk-sayer was white (or yellow, or green, or blue, or whatever) and not a black one ever, EVER, to be seen, but these particular skunk sayers had exactly the same attitude as the ones previously under discussion, do YOU think that RR would behave any differently? Do YOU think that anyone here taking offence at their "sayings" would feel any differently towards them?

    It seems that you do.

    I can tell you that I DON'T. I would be just as terrified of a green skunk-sayer as a yellow one.

    You see, maybe - just perhaps - it's the behaviour that's being objected to and it's nothing to do with their mauveness or their indigoness.


  27. Jessiedog

    Jessiedog Keeping the faith.

    Don't you mean *completely*?


  28. pk

    pk drink flounce rinse repeat

    I'd say it was completely obvious phildwyer is a cunt, as long ago as post 158, when he came out with this:

    What he fails to grasp is the difference between *crack* and *coke*, the difference between sharing a few lines discreetly in the privacy of your own home and standing on a street corner hustling for profits with the back-up of armed watchers who would sell their own mothers for a hit.

    The other huge flaw in his already shit argument whereby the police are all too keen to uphold the law when it comes to people kerbcrawling for drugs, but they are seemingly less keen to arrest the dealers, presumably for fear of provoking some kind of race war or shootout - is absolute proof of his complete ignorance of Brixton street life.

    And that was before he started talking about segregation and walling the dealers in with the prostitutes in his imaginary housing estate, where all drugs are free, there is no money needed for the services of a whore, and medical practitioners are installed in every third house to distribute free condoms/crack pipes/methodone.

    phildwyer made a complete cunt of himself 1249 posts ago.

    No wonder his books are completely slated...

    I'm undecided as to whether he's on a wind up or is as mentally *challenged* as his "everyone is racist except me!" ideas seem to indicate, but at this stage I couldn't give a toss about the twat.

    Leave him to it, life's too short.
  29. RushcroftRoader

    RushcroftRoader Well-Known Member

    :D :D
  30. phildwyer

    phildwyer Gorau arf arf dysg

    He *is* white! Notice that he won't answer my question about his skin colour. There are people of many different hues in Malaysia, in case you didn't know.

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