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Amazon MP3 download service to launch in UK

revol68 said:
that's hardly the issue, the fact is that if i can get away with not paying for something I ain't paying for it, i'll start caring when musicians and record labels start campaigns for the plight of undertipped waitors and the unemployed.

And if these people are artists like they claim then they should be happy just to have their 'art, out there getting an audience.
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thats different than being paid for posts...;):D
 
revol68 said:
And as a communist I don't give a fuck about people getting paid for creating music, i've also got loads of mates in bands who've never been able to make a living off their music and who still do it.
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Maybe that's because they're shit?

Still, I'm enjoying the way you've managed to twist your politics around to justify you giving fuck all back to those people who have made personal sacrifices, put in their own $$$ and hard work to create something that gives you personal enjoyment.

Fuck 'em all eh? You'll just consume their hard work and they can whistle for any kind of reward.

Is that what's communism is all about then?
 
editor said:
Maybe that's because they're shit?

Still, I'm enjoying the way you've managed to twist your politics around to justify you giving fuck all back to those people who have made personal sacrifices, put in their own $$$ and hard work to create something that gives you personal enjoyment.

Fuck 'em all eh? You'll just consume their hard work and they can whistle for any kind of reward.

Is that what's communism is all about then?
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it;s their art, they should be happy someone listens to them, just like i'm just happy knowing you took your time to reply to this.

Like I said under capitalism I don't see anyone worrying about the plight of working class folk doing all the unglamorous jobs.

Anyway i pay into gigs and if they can't get by on that then they can join the rest of us plebs who don't get paid for our 'art' etc etc

Just cos you are in a band and make music doesn' mean you should be guaranteed a living off it.
 
anyway any of the bands or artists i actually really like don't give a fuck about file sharing other than supporting it.

Saul Williams knows the score.
 
revol68 said:
anyway Editor it's not suprising to see you sticking up for the poor petite bourgeois artisan.
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So all musicians are bourgeois, yes?

Are you sure you want to continue along this path of debate because you're on a crash course to make an arse of yourself.
 
editor said:
Neither does it give people like you the right to steal their hard work from them.
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stealing my arse, my definition of stealing is the taking of something that denies someone else the use of it, ie if i steal your DVD you can no longer use it.

The stealing you talk about is simply bourgeois property rights which is theft in itself.
 
revol68 said:
The stealing you talk about is simply bourgeois property rights which is theft in itself.
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So you believe that the creator of an art work/song/painting has no rights over it at all and any spotty Herbert can just walk in their house and help themselves to it, if so inclined?
 
editor said:
So all musicians are bourgeois, yes?

Are you sure you want to continue along this path of debate because you're on a crash course to make an arse of yourself.
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note petite you chump.

Actually some of them are no better than proles being screwed over by record companies (who are the fuckers really responsible for fucking over artists btw), the others who make a direct living off selling their sounds etc are by definition petite bourgeois, it's not a moral judgement just a statement of fact.
 
editor said:
So you believe that the creator of an art work/song/painting has no rights over it at all and any spotty Herbert can just walk in their house and help themselves to it, if so inclined?
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What file sharing service do you use???:eek::eek:
 
editor said:
So let's get it straight: you believe that musicians should give you all their music for free forever and you give them fuck all in return.

Have I got that right?
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No I believe that capitalism is a fucking swindle, that all people should have access to the fruits of human culture whether they can afford to pay for it or not, to deny people such access on the basis of money is an act of theft itself.

Now that doesn't mean bands and musicians are wrong to try and make a living under things as it stands, that's just pragamatism but ultimately talking about filesharing and the like as theft is missing out on the fact it's an act of theft people are forced into by an economic system that is fundamentally criminal.
 
revol68 said:
No I believe that capitalism is a fucking swindle, that all people should have access to the fruits of human culture whether they can afford to pay for it or not, to deny people such access on the basis of money is an act of theft itself.
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But denying musicians a reward for the fruits of their labour is jus' dandy in your book, because you can justify it politically to yourself, despite the musicians being shafted by your selfish actions.

It's a cop out.
 
revol68 said:
zzzz...ultimately talking about filesharing and the like as theft is missing out on the fact it's an act of theft people are forced into by an economic system that is fundamentally criminal.
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No band or consumer is forced into any economic system. If they want to sign to a label which choses to exploit their work as per the contract they sign into then all's fair, likewise the consumer - nobody's forcing nothing on nobody chump.
 
editor said:
But denying musicians a reward for the fruits of their labour is jus' dandy in your book, because you can justify it politically to yourself, despite the musicians being shafted by your selfish actions.

It's a cop out.
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yes Editor, capitalism isn't nice, we are forced into shitting on each other, forgive me if musicians aren't top of my concern list.

Anyway i'm guessing all the mp3's on your pc have been paid for as needed?
 
revol68 said:
Anyway i'm guessing all the mp3's on your pc have been paid for as needed?
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It's not me desperately trying to bend a political belief to excuse ripping off musicians for my own pleasure, but seeing as you asked, I download quite a few MP3s for listening, and if I like the band, I'll invariably buy the CD.
 
editor said:
It's not me desperately trying to bend a political belief to excuse ripping off musicians for my own pleasure, but seeing as you asked, I download quite a few MP3s for listening, and if I like the band, I'll invariably buy the CD.
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Why would i need to bend my politics, like you said my actual politics already give adequate justification.

Anyway I love that old 'oh i buy it if i like it' routine, yeah i'm sure you do with a few but I bet there's stuff you listen to but have no intention of buying the CD.

Anyway if you can afford to do it then congratulations, I can't, do you think that because I earn considerably less than you I should have less right to enjoy music?
 
All this aside...

I still don't get how we ever gonna get to a mindset where the general public will ever value music in the same way again. I could go to HMV.com and find an album for like 2.99 - physical copy, delivered. Likewise I could pick up any number of Sunday papers and find a freebie cd or dvd inside any probably not even bother playing it. They've become almost as worthless as those AOL discs that littered my house for a decade or so.

If plastic discs, with artwork and no copy protection is generally percieved as such low value - then its no wonder people place such low value - if any - on downloads. Its a sorry state for artists and labels really.

When will a digital levy on all isp traffic become apparent as the only way to sustain any digital entertainment via the net I wonder? Or will iTunes/Amazon be enough. I doubt it myself.
 
skyscraper101 said:
All this aside...

I still don't get how we ever gonna get to a mindset where the general public will ever value music in the same way again. I could go to HMV.com and find an album for like 2.99 - physical copy, delivered. Likewise I could pick up any number of Sunday papers and find a freebie cd or dvd inside any probably not even bother playing it. They've become almost as worthless as those AOL discs that littered my house for a decade or so.

If plastic discs, with artwork and no copy protection is generally percieved as such low value - then its no wonder people place such low value - if any - on downloads. Its a sorry state for artists and musicians alike really.

When will a digital levy on all isp traffic become apparent as the only way to sustain any digital entertainment via the net I wonder? Or will iTunes/Amazon be enough. I doubt it myself.
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"When the productive forces progress to a certain stage, the existing production relations become a fetter to the progress of productive forces; at this point, social revolution inevitably occurs."
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;)
 
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