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Air quality in Brixton and Brixton Road

i would have thought the councillors would have a vested interest in this being dealt with being as lambeth town hall's bound to have a rather polluted atmosphere even before you introduce exhaust fumes.
 
The majority of vehicles do not turn left at Acre Lane, they pass right through the centre of Brixton, and a large proportion of these are buses carrying passengers that disembark at Brixton to catch the tube. Why oh why wasn't the Victoria line extended up the A23?
During the planning stages, the Southern terminus wandered all over the place - Wimbledon and Croydon were once considered. But the budget was cut and South London was deemed less worthy (surprise surprise).

You couldn't do it now. Despite all those bus loads coming down the hill, there are plenty of people in Stretham who catch trains or take the bus all the way to work. If the Victoria line was extended that way, it would have to carry not only the existing busloads, but also the people who'd switch from trains and buses. It's pretty much at capacity already and it just couldn't cope with the extra passengers.

The Charing X branch of the Northern line would have been a better contender for extension down the A23, but that's going to Battersea instead, thanks to the developer ££££ available to build it.
 
During the planning stages, the Southern terminus wandered all over the place - Wimbledon and Croydon were once considered. But the budget was cut and South London was deemed less worthy (surprise surprise).

You couldn't do it now. Despite all those bus loads coming down the hill, there are plenty of people in Stretham who catch trains or take the bus all the way to work. If the Victoria line was extended that way, it would have to carry not only the existing busloads, but also the people who'd switch from trains and buses. It's pretty much at capacity already and it just couldn't cope with the extra passengers.

Aparently it is on the cards for 2030. And that is a long time to hold your breath :D

Click on the arrow from Brixton, and then more

http://www.london.gov.uk/mayor-assembly/mayor/vision-2020/interactive-map
 
As a non-driver and non-parent, there's great chunks of this debate I'm really not getting. Maybe I'm just dim.

Why are children driven to school instead of walking? Pollution levels? I walked 2-3 miles to school in South London from age 8 (and it didn't me any harm etc...) I understand the age to get to primary school unaccompanied is far higher than my era so parents would now have to squeeze that in before work - but do they then drive to work?

The Dulwich College buses - just how far are they picking up pupils from? Buses are preferable to a load of private cars but a walk from, say, Hillside Road to the school is OK isn't it?

Why is any idea of less cars, less driving oppressive to anyone - lower income or not? Isn't that what we need?

The Walworth Road in the 70s and 80s was one long traffic jam but is now much thinner in traffic. What changed that traffic pattern? (was much improved before CC so not that)

Answers couched for my simple mind for any of the above gratefully received.
 
Why are children driven to school instead of walking? Pollution levels? I walked 2-3 miles to school in South London from age 8 (and it didn't me any harm etc...) I understand the age to get to primary school unaccompanied is far higher than my era so parents would now have to squeeze that in before work - but do they then drive to work?

Why is any idea of less cars, less driving oppressive to anyone - lower income or not? Isn't that what we need?

I guess people drive to school for safety, time and laziness reasons.

I agree less driving is good. Full stop.
 
I'd imagine that those parents who drive their kids to work then drive home again. I like most to walk my daughter to school, she is on the scooter. We get a real good chat about what she has planned for the day ahead, maybe sing a few songs if she is not grumpy. Time like that is hard to beat. If the weather is bad we'll use the bus. But I then head in to town. If I were going home, I'd probably drive it.
 
There are people with flash cars with loud stereos and they just go round and round in them. I've seen it on particularly long waits for the N2, they circle Brixton Road, Coldharbour Lane and then come back up from that direction again. Three times in ten minutes. Range Rovers, BMWs, Mercs. At least lazy parents on the school run are actually going somewhere.
 
The type of car and entertainment choice is irrelevant. I think they would also claim they were going somewhere, even if it was round in circles..
 
The type of car and entertainment choice is irrelevant. I think they would also claim they were going somewhere, even if it was round in circles..
They're just cruising. It's a form of entertainment. Get a really good car with a bassy bassy stereo. Then head round town in that for the night. Their journey probably stops and starts in the same place, their house, stopping only to pick up their mates who cruise with them. I'm quite envious.
 
Why are children driven to school instead of walking? Pollution levels? I walked 2-3 miles to school in South London from age 8 (and it didn't me any harm etc...) I understand the age to get to primary school unaccompanied is far higher than my era so parents would now have to squeeze that in before work - but do they then drive to work?

I really don't think many children are.
 
They're just cruising. It's a form of entertainment. Get a really good car with a bassy bassy stereo. Then head round town in that for the night. Their journey probably stops and starts in the same place, their house, stopping only to pick up their mates who cruise with them. I'm quite envious.
I'm sure you can strap a mini sound system onto a pimped retro bicycle and cruise on that..
In fact I've seen loads of people doing that already..
 
I'm sure you can strap a mini sound system onto a pimped retro bicycle and cruise on that..
In fact I've seen loads of people doing that already..
That's true. Maybe I just notice the Beemers and the Range Rovers but they're more likely to be driving round in their ma's Fiesta which goes under my radar.
 
That's true. Maybe I just notice the Beemers and the Range Rovers but they're more likely to be driving round in their ma's Fiesta which goes under my radar.

Don't conflate the issue. A lot of (young) people living at home lease unnecessarily prestigious motors because the availabilty of credit makes it possible and because the wish for status makes it desirable.
 
We already have such a scheme, it's called duty on road fuel.

Despite the so-called 'war on the motorist', there's plenty of evidence that driving is pretty cheap, especially when you consider rail fares.

Do motoring taxes exceed the costs of the road network and associated externalities such as pollution?
 
Don't conflate the issue. A lot of (young) people living at home lease unnecessarily prestigious motors because the availabilty of credit makes it possible and because the wish for status makes it desirable.
I don't know what conflate means.

I was only saying that while driving kids to a nearby school is bad, driving round with no destination is worse.
 
Despite the so-called 'war on the motorist', there's plenty of evidence that driving is pretty cheap, especially when you consider rail fares.

Do motoring taxes exceed the costs of the road network and associated externalities such as pollution?
I have no idea. But there is a direct charge with increases with usage.
 
I don't know what conflate means.

I was only saying that while driving kids to a nearby school is bad, driving round with no destination is worse.

Kids have got to have a hobby... Has got to be better than drugs and guns.
 
Despite the so-called 'war on the motorist', there's plenty of evidence that driving is pretty cheap, especially when you consider rail fares.

Do motoring taxes exceed the costs of the road network and associated externalities such as pollution?

I don't think that there's any measure that you could use to objectively claim that there is a 'war on the motorist' - except to count the newspaper headlines containing the phrase, or indeed politicians using the phrase to get admiration from 'hard working families' by declaring that they feel the pain of the motorist.

Take this example, from The Mirror "Labour yesterday vowed to stop demonising motorists and start championing them as it declared its war on drivers was over."

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/labour-car-war-over--new-4730050

In regard to costs and taxes raised from the road network it really depends on how you measure it and who you ask. However I don't think cost benefit analysis' of this nature are very helpful. You can't really put a value on quality of life. You can associate a cost to a life lost through an road traffic accident, a cost of obesity through lack of exercise, costs of traffic jams, the rational is that when you know the cost of something there's a justification to address those costs by investing to resolve the immediate problem

Once you start doing cost benefit analysis you are already committed to a certain point of view. That is one of economic efficiency (ie it's worth making this junction safer at x cost as y amount of people have died at it. Or you can justify an extra lane on a road by pricing the opportunity cost of people sitting in a traffic jam).

What missing about such economic analysis is any kind of vision of what kind of society we want to build. Do we want to continue to invest in, and propagate a car dependant society, is the supposed freedom to be able to drive with minimal personal cost worth having at the expense of stopping children going outside at break times as the playground is too polluted, should our streets automatically be planned to allow maximum flow of cars at the expense of anyone else who's not sitting in a car.

My understanding in that planners plan for more cars being driven more often. The nihilist neo-liberal mind sent directs public money to accommodate the demand. They don't plan for less polluted streets, nor do they plan for cycling, walking, or even public transport displacing the demands of the motorist. They plan for more cars, and we get more cars.
 
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I don't think that there's any measure that you could use to objectively claim that there is a 'war on the motorist' - except to count the newspaper headlines containing the phrase, or indeed politicians using the phrase to get admiration from 'hard working families' by declaring that they feel the pain of the motorist.

Take this example, from The Mirror "Labour yesterday vowed to stop demonising motorists and start championing them as it declared its war on drivers was over."

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/labour-car-war-over--new-4730050

In regard to costs and taxes raised from the road network it really depends on how you measure it and who you ask. However I don't think cost benefit analysis' of this nature are very helpful. You can't really put a value on quality of life. You can associate a cost to a life lost through an road traffic accident, a cost of obesity through lack of exercise, costs of traffic jams, the rational is that when you know the cost of something there's a justification to address those costs by investing to resolve the immediate problem

Once you start doing cost benefit analysis you are already committed to a certain point of view. That is one of economic efficiency (ie it's worth making this junction safer at x cost as y amount of people have died at it. Or you can justify an extra lane on a road by pricing the opportunity cost of people sitting in a traffic jam).

What missing about such economic analysis is any kind of vision of what kind of society we want to build. Do we want to continue to invest in, and propagate a car dependant society, is the supposed freedom to be able to drive with minimal personal cost worth having at the expense of stopping children going outside at break times as the playground is too polluted, should our streets automatically be planned to allow maximum flow of cars at the expense of anyone else who's not sitting in a car.

My understanding in that planners plan for more cars being driven more often. The nihilist neo-liberal mind sent directs public money to accommodate the demand. They don't plan for less polluted streets, nor do they plan for cycling, walking, or even public transport displacing the demands of the motorist. They plan for more cars, and we get more cars.

Agreed: I think you said what I said.
 
Bump. In this BBC article you can search your postcode for pollution levels. I've just done a search for the postcode of the Iceland supermarket in Brixton, and they claim the pollution in that area is 'average'... :hmm:

Pollution hotspots revealed
 
Is there an app or website that gives good quality easy-to-understand localised air quality information? I feel from the tightness in my chest that it must have been poor quality air day in London today.

I was walking earlier alongside the Cromwell Road's mega-monstrous section by West Kensington/Earls Court/Gloucester Ave and could feel the 'roughness' of the air in my throat.
 
Is there an app or website that gives good quality easy-to-understand localised air quality information? I feel from the tightness in my chest that it must have been poor quality air day in London today.

I was walking earlier alongside the Cromwell Road's mega-monstrous section by West Kensington/Earls Court/Gloucester Ave and could feel the 'roughness' of the air in my throat.
London Air (@LondonAir) on Twitter

London Air Quality Network :: Welcome to the London Air Quality Network » Statistics Maps

But. alas

Brixton air pollution monitor is switched off again
 
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