A New Anarchist Organisation

[butchersapron]

yes. When folk had their heads screwed on the right way.

had a look at that praxis site. It's just a load of foolishness, reminds me of the sort of stuff you'd get in 'virus' and other dullness like that. noone other than the three folk who the group consists of will ever have any interest in it, then again i dont suppose they're too bothered about that as groups like this are just set up to give those in them status within their milieu.

If folk wanna affect some change in society why dont folk like that go and volunteer for a few hours in their local citizens advice bureau or something instead of wasting time on all that cobblers.

Nobody.
Gives.
a.
fuck.

Or set up their own independent local-based CAB type service as a starter for other stuff.

 

[chico enrico]

Or set up their own independent local-based CAB type service as a starter for other stuff.

yea mate, starting up a cab service sounds a lot better idea than any of that malarkey. decent wage with the tips.

 

[biff curtains]

The London Coalition Against Poverty (including Haringey Solidarity Group, Hackney Independent, Solfed, and Advisory Service for Squatters among others) seem like a group to watch, they've just succeeded with two low key actions in helping working class people recieve the emergency housing in Hackney that they were entitled to but being denied because of the local Homeless Persons Unit fobbing them off - including a bloke who was sleeping the park and a 19 year old single mother.

They've also been recruiting among non activist people and people who had been active but have become disillousioned.

See either this weeks or next weeks Hackney Gazette for more.

 

[The Black Hand]

The London Coalition Against Poverty (including Haringey Solidarity Group, Hackney Independent, Solfed, and Advisory Service for Squatters among others) seem like a group to watch, they've just succeeded with two low key actions in helping working class people recieve the emergency housing in Hackney that they were entitled to but being denied because of the local Homeless Persons Unit fobbing them off - including a bloke who was sleeping the park and a 19 year old single mother.

They've also been recruiting among non activist people and people who had been active but have become disillousioned.

See either this weeks or next weeks Hackney Gazette for more.

Sounds good

 

[Larry O'Hara]

It is shame Praxis are better than the organisations that exist then

speaking of existence--the international proletariat is yearning for the sort of leadership only your magazine can provide. When will the toiling masses be put out of their misery? When will it take corporeal form?

 

[TopCat]

nah man, i just wish there were some @s who had their heads screwed on the right way round these days. up for a laugh and causing chaos and having a pop at those who deserve it.
like the good old days
not discussing the semantics of that boring old 'organisational platform of the lib. coms' pamphlet bone used to punt about or campaigning for the release of some bloke who sounds like jeffrey dahmer with a couple of bakunin books on his shelf.
it's just nuttiness, and it's a shame there doesn't seem to be any one (or group?) to counter it.

Hear hear.

 

[biff curtains]

Sounds good

And it's in this weeks Hackney Gazette!

 

[treelover]

couldn't find anything about LCAP, but did find this bit

Anne Goldenberg
A STOKE Newington activist, who fought fascists at the Battle of Cable Street in the 1930s and in her later years became a dedicated champion of older people, has died, aged 88.

Anne Goldenberg, who lived in Farleigh Road, was a tireless campaigner for older people's rights.

She was an active member of the Hackney Pensioners' Convention and a trustee of Age Concern Hackney.

She also chaired the editorial board of the Hackney Pensioners' Press, a free magazine which was distributed quarterly from 1985 to 2000.

Mrs Goldenberg was born in September, 1918, to Jewish immigrant parents in Mile End in east London.

She was a member of the Young Communist League and was among the demonstrators determined to block a march by Oswald Mosley and his blackshirts through Cable Street in 1936.
http://www.hackneygazette.co.uk/con...=newshkyg&itemid=WeED05 Jul 2007 12:21:41:203

 

[glenquagmire]

I was at a party full of SWPers on Farleigh Road the other week. I bet they'd have creamed themselves if they knew they had a Cable Street veteran next door.

 

[JoePolitix]

Whereas you just take shit like that in your stride cos that's how you role yeah?

 

[biff curtains]

I was at a party full of SWPers on Farleigh Road the other week. I bet they'd have creamed themselves if they knew they had a Cable Street veteran next door.

I would cream myself tbh.

 

[glenquagmire]

Yes, I would have loved to meet her and ask about all that stuff myself. But I know quite a few veterans of those East End fights against the fascists and many grew up to be bitter, often unpleasant people, and diehard zionists. Bit depressing.

I didn't quite understand JoePolitix' posting. Maybe I'm out of touch with today's neologisms.

 

[The Black Hand]

speaking of existence--the international proletariat is yearning for the sort of leadership only your magazine can provide. When will the toiling masses be put out of their misery? When will it take corporeal form?

I am following your production standards of one a year Larry

 

[Brainaddict]

From their aims and principles:

"The world’s wealth is produced by us, the working class."



Hope they're keepin' up the old links with those chinese and indian factory workers!

 

[JHE]

"The world’s wealth is produced by us, the working class."

I'm sure a scholarly chap like Professor Attica can identify the source of the following riposte.

"Labour is not the source of all wealth. Nature is just as much the source of use values (and it is surely of such that material wealth consists!) as labour, which itself is only the manifestation of a force of nature, human labour power."​

 

[TremulousTetra]

"The world’s wealth is produced by us, the working class."

I'm sure a scholarly chap like Professor Attica can identify the source of the following riposte.

"Labour is not the source of all wealth. Nature is just as much the source of use values (and it is surely of such that material wealth consists!) as labour, which itself is only the manifestation of a force of nature, human labour power."​

Karl Marx. But the statement needs to be put in context.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_theory_of_value

 

[JHE]

Karl Marx.

Marx was of course the author. I'll give you half a mark for that. The source is Charlie M's posthumously published Critique of the Gotha Programme.

Still, after all this time, socialists and anarchists like to claim that labour is the source of all wealth or, even less accurately, the working class is the source of all wealth.

"Workers create all the wealth under capitalism," claims another sect.

 

[TremulousTetra]

chat tomoro ye

 

[mk12]

The source is Charlie M's posthumously published Critique of the Gotha Programme.

The Second Communist Manifesto.

 

[Larry O'Hara]

I am following your production standards of one a year Larry

so does that mean there has been one? If not, your standards are zero per life-time....Not the same at all.

 

[TremulousTetra]

Marx was of course the author. I'll give you half a mark for that. The source is Charlie M's posthumously published Critique of the Gotha Programme.

Still, after all this time, socialists and anarchists like to claim that labour is the source of all wealth or, even less accurately, the working class is the source of all wealth.

"Workers create all the wealth under capitalism," claims another sect.

you are completely wrong. Socialist and anarchist do not "like to claim", they do in fact categorically claim that "Labour IS the source of all wealth" or MORE ACCURATELY value. And the inspiration and source of this perspective for Marx, was Adam Smith.

nobody has produced an argument which undermines the idea that Labour is the source of all value, or provided an adequate alternative explanation of the workings of 'Kapital'. If you feel there is an argument that does either of these, then give us an outline so we can test the validity of your argument.

 

[The Black Hand]

so does that mean there has been one? If not, your standards are zero per life-time....Not the same at all.

Sorry old man your memory is failing you badly. I have put out many magazines over the years - more than your numbers of Borderland

As it goes our magazine will be out very soon.

 

[Larry O'Hara]

Sorry old man your memory is failing you badly. I have put out many magazines over the years - more than your numbers of Borderland

As it goes our magazine will be out very soon.

1) which magazines--name some.

2) the question was about the magazine you have been touting on these very boards--and the hard fact is, to date, it has not materialised, ever.

3) I have written/published things other than Notes From the Borderland too, over the years. So it is not comparing like with like, but something that exists with something that does not, yet.

4) Can you quantify "very soon"?

 

[The Black Hand]

1) which magazines--name some.

2) the question was about the magazine you have been touting on these very boards--and the hard fact is, to date, it has not materialised, ever.

3) I have written/published things other than Notes From the Borderland too, over the years. So it is not comparing like with like, but something that exists with something that does not, yet.

4) Can you quantify "very soon"?

Sorry Larry can't be bothered.

 

[Larry O'Hara]

Sorry Larry can't be bothered.

in other words, there is no magazine--fair enough.

 

[Luther Blissett]

You weren't at the recent anarchist conference in Loughboro, were you, Attica.

 

[Brainaddict]

nobody has produced an argument which undermines the idea that Labour is the source of all value, or provided an adequate alternative explanation of the workings of 'Kapital'. If you feel there is an argument that does either of these, then give us an outline so we can test the validity of your argument.

Um, most of the rest of modern economic theory?

Have you read some of the ridiculous things Marx had to argue to support his labour theory of value? For instance he had to argue that a machine making an item with little or no assistance from humans requires the equivalent maintenance per item made to the labour that would have gone into it without the machine, thus ensuring that it is still human labour creating the value. Which is piffle, frankly

 

[Luther Blissett]

For those who missed it, these were among the main threads of discussion
http://www.lboro.ac.uk/departments/eu/CSIG/CivilRightsConf.html

The Poverty of Sovereignty
Alex Prichard, Michael Mulligan

Openness contra property: The Internet, the global governance of intellectual property and alternative models for the utilisation of valuable knowledge.
Christopher May

Anarcho-Cosmopolitanism
Clive Gabay

The Road to ‘Polyvalency’: “Remarks on Yugoslav Federalism”
Matthew McCullock

The Rise and Fall of Transnational Civil Society
Thomas Richard Davies

Power and Anarchy – In/equality + In/visibility in Autonomous Politics
Uri Gordon

Anarchism, Vanguards and Paternalism – Problems of collective resistance
Benjamin Franks

Mothering the other- Women and Mother politics in Sri Lanka
Zinthiya Ganeshpanchan

The Social Logic of the State: Kropotkin’s ‘Political Principle’ and Totalitarianism in Everyday Life
Andrew Robinson

(Note the lack of violent fetishism when confronting government - something our American, Israeli, Italian and Palestinian brothers and sisters have learned is vital to avoid)

Conference report to follow, as soon as it's circulated.

 

[Fruitloop]

Um, most of the rest of modern economic theory?

Have you read some of the ridiculous things Marx had to argue to support his labour theory of value? For instance he had to argue that a machine making an item with little or no assistance from humans requires the equivalent maintenance per item made to the labour that would have gone into it without the machine, thus ensuring that it is still human labour creating the value. Which is piffle, frankly

Did he? Where?

That does sound pretty loony tbh.

 

[butchersapron]

Um, most of the rest of modern economic theory?

Have you read some of the ridiculous things Marx had to argue to support his labour theory of value? For instance he had to argue that a machine making an item with little or no assistance from humans requires the equivalent maintenance per item made to the labour that would have gone into it without the machine, thus ensuring that it is still human labour creating the value. Which is piffle, frankly

No he didn't, he said that were a situation such as you describe to exist (i.e almost complete automation) then the law of value would no longer exist.