on the road again
It's been calculated again, this time by economists at the GLA.
How much do you reckon?
How much do you reckon?
Which basically means it's not a living wage at all, it's an average of what everyone earns.LGA Economists said:The Family Budget Unit, estimates the costs of a ‘Low Cost but Acceptable’ (LCA)budget for a selection of typical or model families. This approach calculates the wage required to meet those costs, and is also termed the Basic Living Costs approach.
Next, using the ‘Income Distribution’ approach, 60 per cent of median income is taken as the poverty line. This is consistent with the Government’s usual definition of relative poverty. This approach estimates the wage required to achieve 60 per cent of median income for the same typical or model families.
An average of these two methods is used to calculate a ‘poverty threshold’ wage. However, a ‘living wage’ must yield a secure margin ensuring that the person involved does not fall to the level of poverty wages. Therefore, a margin of 15 per cent is applied to the poverty threshold wage, to obtain the living wage in London. This is added to protect individuals against the possibility of falling into poverty as a result of unforeseen expenses.
Taking the average of these two figures gives the estimate of the ‘poverty threshold wage’ of £6.15 per hour. Adding the 15 per cent margin to the calculated poverty threshold wage, yields a fi gure, when rounded to the nearest 5 pence, of £7.05 per hour as the living wage for London.
wankersGLA said:The Living Wage Unit will continue to undertake research in particular to increase our understanding of the patterns of low pay in London, and trying to improve our estimates of the incidence of low pay in London.
Yup, that was my reason for quoting high. My living costs are "Graciously subsidised" but looking around at average rental it looks as if a Londoner could easily lose £10 -15k to rent, another £1,000 to Council Tax, £2,000 on utilities? Then food =£ Travel =£ Clothingmarty21 said:the big factor is housing costs, at a stretch i could probably live on 15k as i only pay about 200 quid a month for my bit of the mortgage, but average rents are fairly high i would have thought
we're lucky in a lot of ways, we bought at a time when prices were very low, i doubt i could afford to pay the mortgage on this flat now if i was buying it today (actually i doubt i would be able to get a mortgage on it)Sweetpea said:Yup, that was my reason for quoting high. My living costs are "Graciously subsidised" but looking around at average rental it looks as if a Londoner could easily lose £10 -15k to rent, another £1,000 to Council Tax, £2,000 on utilities? Then food =£ Travel =£ Clothing
Sorry for being nosey.. do they not give you the £6000 until you pass the PGCE?scifisam said:Background: I'm a PGCE student and get the teacher training bursary of £6000, plus student loan in theory, but in practice I have only got another thousand in student loan and grant .
I wasn't counting pay for lunch hour. You can check my figures yourself. It's not unusual to work 40 billed hours, but I did mention that even at 35 hours (40 minus 5 hours for lunch), it's not that bad either - it's £12,776. With a regular tax code and NI on top, that's £873pcm net. Hard to live on, but not impossible - very hard to support a family on, but theoretically you wouldn't have to (thanks to WTC), and in practice you would usually get quite a big top-up.citydreams said:to be fair, I think scifisam has got his sums wrong.. no-one pays you for your lunch hour, so the annual wage, less bank holidays is really around the £12k mark.
You don't get it (if you qualify for it at all) until 1 year and 1 term later. You do your PGCE. Then you do your NQT year. Then you have have to work one whole term - then you get it - although people I worked with got it by the October half term.citydreams said:Sorry for being nosey.. do they not give you the £6000 until you pass the PGCE?
So one hand offers you a living wage approx £12k a year and the other offers you £6k to get a job where you'd be hoping to be payed more than that. Welcome to London.scifisam said:Citydreams - you're thinking of the 'Golden Hello,' which I think I will get when I start my job (not everyone gets it). The £6000 I'm talking about is the teacher training salary, paid monthly during the course (well, paid for none months of the ten month course, anyway).
It is if you're in a half decent permanent job, but many people who are earning near this "living wage" and who are paid hourly don't get this.Zappomatic said:And isn't it quite normal to get paid for bank holidays, time off sick and holiday?
Come off it, on £22k you can easily find a studio flat in London.Donna Ferentes said:I've said numerous times that I left the country primarily because of the impossibility of finding secure accommodation in London. This is the real problem. I was on 22K, not great money but not poverty wages by any means: and I couldn't find so much as a studio flat to rent on anything like what I could afford.
But the odd thing was, I could afford to go out, to have a holiday or two, to live pretty well by the standards of the world generally. Obviously I wouldn't accept it if somebody on 40K told me I was doing all right - I have a real and justified animus against people on comfortable incomes telling the less comfortable what they should accept - but nevertheless, leaving questions of social inequality to one side for a moment, I wasn't doing so badly except for the ludicrous level of housing costs. "Housing ladder" nothing, I couldn't afford to rent a flat on my own, and that as a professional at the age of forty. The result was endemic stress (since without secure accommodation, you can be out on your ear at any time) and a permanent feeling of not being valued by the society to which I contributed.
Wages are important - you won't find me saying any different - but it's housing costs, in London and the South-East, that are the real problem. That's where you need precisely the sort of sizeable government intervention that you are not going to get.