7 year olds compulsory language

[LilMissHissyFit]

Yes, I'm fully in favour of this, but it does need to be properly tied into the secondary system, otherwise you're simply going to get kids who can count to ten and name all the fruits in another language and you'll be back to square one.

This is Key I think... capitalising on young childrens innate ability to pick up and use language is imperative

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

So how is your kid's Welsh coming along?

fine thanks... Im not that bothered so long as they are happy. My stance is teach it properly or stop wasting everyones time.
They arent being taught it properly ( to what i would consider fluency)but so long as they are happy...If they werent I would withdraw them

 

[Brockway]

My stance is teach it properly or stop wasting everyones time.

I agree which is why it should be compulsory from day 1.

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

It is and still kids dont come out fluent... or did you not know that?

 

[Poot]

Are you on the rag - you seem a bit upset

This surely must go down as "persuasive and considered argument of the week"?

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

This surely must go down as "persuasive and considered argument of the week"?

the argument of someone who has little to actually argue

 

[Brockway]

It is and still kids dont come out fluent... or did you not know that?

But you are saying that kids should be learning French or another language from an early age. If Welsh is being taught properly from day 1 and kids are still not becoming fluent in it how come you are so sure they will be able to speak French? You seem to be contradicting yourself. I don't know why you hate Welsh so much - seems a bit weird to me.

 

[Brockway]

the argument of someone who has little to actually argue

I'll argue with you all night if you want.

 

[ramjamclub]

We had a holiday in North wales a few years ago and stayed at Portmadoc.
One evening we went to a local pub which was full. I think it was market day.
Anyhow we tried to be friendly to the locals, who were only speaking welsh.
They ignored us because of my London accent. We then carried on talking in Dutch which completly threw them. When asked we said, we are from Amsterdam, they mood changed then and they even bought us a beer!! Funny what languages can do to people.

 

[Dirty Martini]

It is and still kids dont come out fluent... or did you not know that?

I think fluency is more than any teacher (or kid) can expect from a school language course, even up to A level -- unless there is constant engagement with the language, even if that's simply through TV, books, etc., outside the classroom.

I think the most important role that languages can play in schools, aside from teaching those who might want to continue and aim for fluency at some point later, is to teach a set of reasoning skills to kids as a whole that can be taken into all their other fields of study ...

 

[Brockway]

We had a holiday in North wales a rew years ago and stayed at Portmadoc.
One evening we went to a local pub which was full. I think it was market day.
Anyhow we tried to be friendly to the locals who were only speaking welsh.
They ignored us because of my London accent. We carried on talking in Dutch which completly threw them. When asked we said we are from Amsterdam, they mood changed then and they even bought us a beer!! Funny what languages can do to people.

The main reason I'd like to learn Welsh is so that I could stop speaking it when an Englishman walked into the pub (for some reason the pub is always located in N Wales).

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

But you are saying that kids should be learning French or another language from an early age. If Welsh is being taught properly from day 1 and kids are still not becoming fluent in it how come you are so sure they will be able to speak French? You seem to be contradicting yourself. I don't know why you hate Welsh so much - seems a bit weird to me.

THEY ARENT TAUGHT IT PROPERLY

is that not clear enough for you?
I dont hate welsh. However I think its pointless teaching a language to children if its not taught properly( to fluency at an early age)- its a waste of time

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

I think fluency is more than any teacher (or kid) can expect from a school language course, even up to A level -- unless there is constant engagement with the language, even if that's simply through TV, books, etc., outside the classroom.

I think the most important role that languages can play in schools, aside from teaching those who might want to continue and aim for fluency at some point later, is to teach a set of reasoning skills to kids as a whole that can be taken into all their other fields of study ...

I disagree. If children in the netherlands can be fluent in english( most dutch people Ive met can converse well conversationally and use english in the workplace) by the time they leave school why can our children not expect the same?
when english is apparently one of the most difficult languages to master and they dont start their formal schooling until age 7

 

[Brockway]

THEY ARENT TAUGHT IT PROPERLY

is that not clear enough for you?
I dont hate welsh. However I think its pointless teaching a language to children if its not taught properly( to fluency at an early age)- its a waste of time

But you're confident that French WILL BE TAUGHT PROPERLY? How come?

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

No Im not,please, show me where Ive said that?

 

[Brockway]

No Im not,please, show me where Ive said that?

So you're not confident ANY language will be taught properly in any school, in any area, from an early age?

 

[ramjamclub]

The main reason I'd like to learn Welsh is so that I could stop speaking it when an Englishman walked into the pub (for some reason the pub is always located in N Wales).

do you speak any other language than rubbish mate

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

So you're not confident ANY language will be taught properly in any school, in any area, from an early age?

If its taught as its taught in other progressive european nations such as France or the netherlands yes I have no reason to be worried. As languages are taught here at present- no, no confidence at all that the majority will be fluent- hell kids here dont even gain fluency in english!

 

[Brockway]

do you speak any other language than rubbish mate

Got any more interesting Dutch anecdotes?

 

[ramjamclub]

Got any more interesting Dutch anecdotes?

jawel lul dat je bent, maar dat snap jij toch niet

 

[Brockway]

If its taught as its taught in other progressive european nations such as France or the netherlands yes I have no reason to be worried. As languages are taught here at present- no, no confidence at all that the majority will be fluent- hell kids here dont even gain fluency in english!

Fair enough. I've got the thread of your argument now.

Now about you calling me a "cunt" and an "idiot". Is there any need for that? Do you know me? Have I called you a "cunt"?

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

laa laaa laaa laa laaa
You see ^^^^ thats what your attacks look like to me- pathetic=cunt/idiot
Im not 'now getting' anything
Thats what Ive always thought- its only through repeatedly explaining to you ( who appears to be terminaly dim or selectively blind) that you start to get it through the "OOOOH FURY FURY someones suggesting their child shouldnt have to learn welsh ANTI WELSH ANTI WELSH" rantings that occupy your tiny mind

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

laa laaa laaa laa laaa
You see ^^^^ thats what your attacks look like to me- pathetic=cunt/idiot if you like

Thats what Ive always thought- its only through repeatedly explaining to you ( who appears to be terminaly dim or selectively blind) that you start to get it through the "OOOOH FURY FURY someones suggesting their child shouldnt have to learn welsh ANTI WELSH ANTI WELSH" rantings that occupy your tiny mind

 

[Dirty Martini]

I disagree. If children in the netherlands can be fluent in english( most dutch people Ive met can converse well conversationally and use english in the workplace) by the time they leave school why can our children not expect the same?
when english is apparently one of the most difficult languages to master and they dont start their formal schooling until age 7

Well, again it's the amount of exposure to English, and the kind of exposure, which is the key to Dutch proficiency. English and US films, TV (the BBC is widely watched in Holland), music -- all the kinds of things that speak directly to kids and teenagers. It's a small language community as well -- not speaking English won't get you very far in employment, plus there's the historical role played by Amsterdam as an international city, plus the number of English speakers in the country, and so on.

It seems to me that the larger the language community, the less likely its young people are to learn other languages to a certain level of proficiency or in huge numbers. It's not a hard and fast rule (look at Germany), but Italians, Spanish and French kids don't come anywhere near the top of the league for language learning (although my experience is that it's improving). More competition from homegrown cultural products, less need to look to English to improve employment prospects.

If British kids were exposed to French or German culture (for example) at home to the same extent, this would help greatly. But that's not something that can be enforced, nor is it likely to happen with the stranglehold that English-speaking culture has over the rest of the world.

 

[Brockway]

^^^^^^
And that looks really grown up.

 

[Brockway]

jawel lul dat je bent, maar dat snap jij toch niet

Twll tin y gont hoyw

 

[LilMissHissyFit]

Well, again it's the amount of exposure to English, and the kind of exposure, which is the key to Dutch proficiency. English and US films, TV (the BBC is widely watched in Holland), music -- all the kinds of things that speak directly to kids and teenagers. It's a small language community as well -- not speaking English won't get you very far in employment, plus there's the historical role played by Amsterdam as an international city, plus the number of English speakers in the country, and so on.

It seems to me that the larger the language community, the less likely its young people are to learn other languages to a certain level of proficiency or in huge numbers. It's not a hard and fast rule (look at Germany), but Italians, Spanish and French kids don't come anywhere near the top of the league for language learning (although my experience is that it's improving). More competition from homegrown cultural products, less need to look to English to improve employment prospects.

If British kids were exposed to French or German culture (for example) at home to the same extent, this would help greatly. But that's not something that can be enforced, nor is it likely to happen with the stranglehold that English-speaking culture has over the rest of the world.

You know, those are really good points. I can see where you are coming from.

 

[Brockway]

laa laaa laaa laa laaa
You see ^^^^ thats what your attacks look like to me- pathetic=cunt/idiot if you like

Thats what Ive always thought- its only through repeatedly explaining to you ( who appears to be terminaly dim or selectively blind) that you start to get it through the "OOOOH FURY FURY someones suggesting their child shouldnt have to learn welsh ANTI WELSH ANTI WELSH" rantings that occupy your tiny mind

I honestly don't remember having a conversation/arguement/debate with you about anything. You seem to have a persecution complex

 

[ramjamclub]

Twll tin y gont hoyw

are you a gay arsehole?

 

[Brockway]

are you a gay arsehole?

No, I'm not - are you?