24% get A grades at A level
- Thread starter trashpony
- Start date
Sean
Well-Known Member
Some of the brightest students I teach find it really tough doing 4 A Levels and I think to do more is totally mental. If you're allocating 6 periods a week to each A Level, even discounting General Studies and Critical Thinking as lower timetabling commitments, you're going to have 48 periods a week. Our college has only 32 periods in its timetable!
And our students - many from very impoverished inner city backgrounds - are getting into Oxbridge and top unis. Yeah, many of them find it a real challenge, but then I'd hope they did in many respects.
I still maintain that (certainly for the main subject area I'm involved in, English) the A Levels haven't dumbed down but require very different skills. QCA are now saying that students will have to study even more texts for Lit A Level (12, I think), so it's getting tougher...
And our students - many from very impoverished inner city backgrounds - are getting into Oxbridge and top unis. Yeah, many of them find it a real challenge, but then I'd hope they did in many respects.
I still maintain that (certainly for the main subject area I'm involved in, English) the A Levels haven't dumbed down but require very different skills. QCA are now saying that students will have to study even more texts for Lit A Level (12, I think), so it's getting tougher...
The '16% = C grade' idea works like this: there are four questions on that GCSE paper. These are graded in order of difficulty. Someone with a C grade level of ability should be able to answer the first question, but would not be expected to be able to answer the next 3 questions, which would be more difficult. Someone with a higher level of ability (deserving of a B grade) should be able to answer both the first and the second questions, but not the next two. Only someone deserving of an A* grade would be expected to be able to answer all 4 questions. Therefore, someone expecting a C grade would only ever be expected to be able to answer 25% of the entire paper. Getting 16% would theoretically mean that they answered about 65% of the first question correctly (i.e. the only question aimed at someone of their ability).
Of course, the fact that you could guess at all of the questions, pick up 16% in 'attempt' marks and sail out with a pass despite knowing nothing does not appear to have entered the exam boards' collective thoughts.
I think students are capable of doing more than 3 A levels. I took 8 subjects in the Irish Leaving Certificate, each of which is officially considered to be worth two-thirds of an A Level (i.e. I have something vaguely equivalent to 5 A levels). We never had timetabling issues, but you were expected to do quite a lot of the work independently in your own time. Most people in my (non-selective) school did 7 or 8 subjects and very few failed anything. Irish universities are picking up on the fact that British students with 3 A grades at A level are often less bright than Irish students with a bunch of A grades from the Leaving Certificate. Trinity College in Dublin is refusing to admit British students with with 3 A grades at A level on its medical courses as they just can't keep up (4 A grades is the minimum). I think several of the other Irish universities are considering following suit...
Of course, the fact that you could guess at all of the questions, pick up 16% in 'attempt' marks and sail out with a pass despite knowing nothing does not appear to have entered the exam boards' collective thoughts.
I think students are capable of doing more than 3 A levels. I took 8 subjects in the Irish Leaving Certificate, each of which is officially considered to be worth two-thirds of an A Level (i.e. I have something vaguely equivalent to 5 A levels). We never had timetabling issues, but you were expected to do quite a lot of the work independently in your own time. Most people in my (non-selective) school did 7 or 8 subjects and very few failed anything. Irish universities are picking up on the fact that British students with 3 A grades at A level are often less bright than Irish students with a bunch of A grades from the Leaving Certificate. Trinity College in Dublin is refusing to admit British students with with 3 A grades at A level on its medical courses as they just can't keep up (4 A grades is the minimum). I think several of the other Irish universities are considering following suit...
The people I know who got 10 A grade A levels (both of them, the only two) did it by virtue of being extremely intelligent. They could do a couple years of A level standard study in two weeks. They sat all the exams in the same year (totalling something in the order of 78 hours of exams in one 'season').
On interns and spelling, it should be noted that spelling is more something learnt, rather than something to do with learning.
ie. the way things are rather than how to find out the way things are and are together. In short, ribbing people for spelling is stupid.
On interns and spelling, it should be noted that spelling is more something learnt, rather than something to do with learning.
ie. the way things are rather than how to find out the way things are and are together. In short, ribbing people for spelling is stupid.
tangerinedream
Density of Sound
the B said:
Not critical thinking they don't - the sole reason for it's introduction was to enable better differentiation between high achieving students, admittadly not every university bothers with it, but some see it's presence as indicative of a high quality student naturally adept at, well critical thinking. - Whilst you may say 'good' uni's discount general studies, they may well use it unofficially to differentiate between student who achieve entry requirements - Some red bricks like it, some don't pay any attention to it at all.
When did these people take their ten a-levels? (i.e, how long ago?)
tangerinedream
Density of Sound
the B said:
how on earth did they get 10 pieces of coursework done and submitted - presumably they didn't have tuition in all the classes - how did they know what to do???
(I'm not doubting you at all, just even the most talented kids I know - and I know a few get pretty shattered doing 6 a levels (including gs and ct - so only 4 f/t ones) therefore am oddly curious.
They're fantastic. Basically. I believe both took Maths, Further Maths and Additional Further Maths amongst their 10 so that would have helped to condense things a bit since coursework isn't so important...
But amongst all the modules they sat during the course of 10 A levels, they both got 100% in over half their modules.
Anyway, the fact that more are getting good grades doesn't mean that it isn't possible to show exceptional ability in the system. Just that there is an issue with the system changing over time. If you're a uni looking to take people year on year, you're on the pulse of things so it isn't too bad.
If you're an employer, could be trickier but would you really use A level results that much? And is it so hard to interview people etc.
But amongst all the modules they sat during the course of 10 A levels, they both got 100% in over half their modules.
Anyway, the fact that more are getting good grades doesn't mean that it isn't possible to show exceptional ability in the system. Just that there is an issue with the system changing over time. If you're a uni looking to take people year on year, you're on the pulse of things so it isn't too bad.
If you're an employer, could be trickier but would you really use A level results that much? And is it so hard to interview people etc.
the B said:
Where is the news report please?
First one
http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:...tml+paul+jefferys+a+levels&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=4
Worth noting, he won the International Olympiad.
Second one
http://www.yorkshiretoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=55&ArticleID=1701656
But who needs a news report anyway?
Would there be any reason to doubt what I'm saying? Newbies... 
http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:...tml+paul+jefferys+a+levels&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=4
Worth noting, he won the International Olympiad.
Second one
http://www.yorkshiretoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=55&ArticleID=1701656
But who needs a news report anyway?
Would there be any reason to doubt what I'm saying? Newbies... 
I think that they should go back to "norm referencing" A Levels - then there would be no need to have this endless discussion every year about how the exams are getting easier etc etc.
Norm-referencing ensures that the top 10% of a given year get an "A", the next 15% or whatever get a "B" etc.
Then it doesn't matter if one year the exam is easier or harder - the best 10% who did that paper will get an "A".
No more need to do 6 A Levels to impress. No need to have "A*" or "A***" or whatever bollocks they think of next.
That's how it worked up until around 1987.
Giles..
Norm-referencing ensures that the top 10% of a given year get an "A", the next 15% or whatever get a "B" etc.
Then it doesn't matter if one year the exam is easier or harder - the best 10% who did that paper will get an "A".
No more need to do 6 A Levels to impress. No need to have "A*" or "A***" or whatever bollocks they think of next.
That's how it worked up until around 1987.
Giles..
Sean
Well-Known Member
Norm-referencing is bollocks. It's designed to create an elite and prevent the great unwashed getting into the unis. Whatever the failings of the current system, at least criteria-referencing is relatively transparent.
I blame the unis for a lot of this dumbing down argument every year. If they got off their lazy arses and selected their own students with a bit more skill, instead of expecting things to be like they were in 1987 things would be better.
I blame the unis for a lot of this dumbing down argument every year. If they got off their lazy arses and selected their own students with a bit more skill, instead of expecting things to be like they were in 1987 things would be better.
Sean said:
Norm-referencing has nothing to do with the percentage of school-leavers who get into Uni. That is a decision for the politicians.
If the government decide that the brightest 10%, 20%, 40%, or even 50%, should have places at universities, and fund those places, then Unis just adjust their grade requirements accordingly.
Norm-referencing would just mean that there wouldn't be this crazy situation where each year the marks and grades mysteriously "improve", thus bringing the whole exam into disrepute.
I don't see how the universities can "select their own students with a bit more skill". Whenever they do use other methods, like doing their own exams, or by making bigger use of personal interviews, they get criticised again for encouraging "elitism" because wealthier parents, and wealthier schools, can afford to prepare students for specific tests, and private school kids are supposedly known for being more articulate in interviews.
Giles..
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