130 dead in Baghdad market bomb

[Dandred]

I'm not saying that it's right, I'm saying that that's what happens.

The retaliation for those acts, also happens.

The retaliation for the acts of dropping bombs and guiding missiles that killed large numbers of Iraqi men women and children.

How would you fight an ememy that stayed out of reach with the death from above approach, wouldn't you lash out at the first thing that was connected with so many innocent deaths.

I can't justify beheading and dismembement but I can see why those people where so pissed of to do somethinglike that........

Can you justify sitting at 20,000 feet and blowing up men women and children at teh click of a button?

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

The retaliation for the acts of dropping bombs and guiding missiles that killed large numbers of Iraqi men women and children.

How would you fight an ememy that stayed out of reach with the death from above approach, wouldn't you lash out at the first thing that was connected with so many innocent deaths.

I can't justify beheading and dismembement but I can see why those people where so pissed of to do somethinglike that........

Can you justify sitting at 20,000 feet and blowing up men women and children at teh click of a button?

I didn't realize that Iraq was being carpet bombed.

 

[Dandred]

I didn't realize that Iraq was being carpet bombed.

I didn't realize I said it was.........Oh, I didn't. More shit from you.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

I didn't realize I said it was.........Oh, I didn't. More shit from you.

No, you said americans were killing people from 20,000 feet at the click of a button, and I'm saying you're full of shit.

 

[newharper]

I didn't realize that Omaha Beach, the Ardennes Forest, Iwo Jima, Okinawa, etc, were won through the use of air power.

While i would never denigrate the sacrifice of those who died, the US contribution to WW2, while relevant, hardly scarred the national psyche to the extent it did to most European nations.

However Vietnam seems to have made the US body politic scared to death of the butchers bill, (for Americans).

This invokes scorn in the rest of the world.

Albania[1] 1,073,000 28,000 200 28,200 2.63%
Australia[2] 6,998,000 40,400 100 40,500 0.58%
Austria[3] 6,653,000 45,000 65,000 110,000 1.65%
Belgium[4] 8,387,000 12,100 52,000 24,000 88,100 1.05%
Brazil[5] 40,289,000 1,000 2,000 0.00%
Bulgaria[6] 6,458,000 22,000 22,000 0.34%
Burma[7] 16,119,000 60,000 60,000 0.37%
Canada[8] 11,267,000 45,300 45,300 0.40%
China[9] 517,568,000 3,000,000 7,000,000 10,000,000 1.93%
Cuba[10] 4,235,000 100 100 0.00%
Czechoslovakia[11] 15,300,000 25,000 63,000 277,000 365,000 2.39%
Denmark[12] 3,795,000 1,300 1,800 100 3,200 0.08%
Estonia[13] 1,134,000 40,000 1,000 41,000 3.62%
Ethiopia[14] 17,700,000 5,000 200,000 205,000 1.16%
Finland[15] 3,700,000 95,000 2,000 97,000 2.62%
France[16] 41,700,000 212,000 267,000 83,000 562,000 1.35%
French Indo-China[17] 24,600,000 1,000,000 1,000,000 4.07%
Germany[18][19][20] 69,623,000 5,500,000 1,840,000 160,000 7,500,000 10.77%
Greece[21] 7,222,000 20,000 209,000 71,000 300,000 4.15%
Hungary[22] 9,129,000 300,000 80,000 200,000 580,000 6.35%
Iceland[23] 119,000 200 200 0.17%
India[24] 378,000,000 87,000 1,500,000 1,587,000 0.42%
Indonesia[25] 69,435,000 4,000,000 4,000,000 5.76%
Iran[26] 14,340,000 200 200 0.00%
Iraq[27] 3,698,000 1,000 1,000 0.03%
Ireland[28] 2,960,000 200 200 0.00%
Italy[29] 44,394,000 306,400 145,100 8,000 459,500 1.04%
Japan[30] 71,380,000 2,000,000 600,000 2,600,000 3.61%
Korea[31] 23,400,000 60,000 60,000 0.26%
Latvia[32] 1,995,000 147,000 80,000 227,000 11.38%
Lithuania[33] 2,575,000 212,000 141,000 353,000 13.71%
Luxembourg[34] 295,000 1,000 1,000 2,000 0.68%
Malaya[35] 4,391,000 100,000 100,000 2.28%
Malta[36] 269,000 1,500 1,500 0.56%
Mexico[37] 19,320,000 100 100 0.00%
Mongolia[38] 819,000 300 300 0.04%
Netherlands[39] 8,729,000 7,900 92,000 106,000 205,900 2.36%
Newfoundland[40] 300,000 1,000 100 1,100 0.37%
New Zealand[41] 1,629,000 11,900 11,900 0.73%
Norway[42] 2,945,000 3,000 5,800 700 9,500 0.32%
Philippines[43] 16,000,000 57,000 90,000 147,000 0.92%
Pacific Islands[44] 1,900,000 57,000 57,000 3.0%
Poland[45] 34,775,000 400,000 2,200,000 3,000,000 5,600,000 16.10%
Portuguese Timor[46] 500,000 55,000 55,000 11.0%
Romania[47] 19,934,000 316,000 56,000 469,000 841,000 4.22%
Singapore[48] 728,000 50,000 50,000 6.87%
South Africa[49] 10,160,000 11,900 11,900 0.12%
Soviet Union[50] 168,500,000 10,700,000 11,500,000 1,000,000 23,200,000 13.77%
Spain[51] 25,637,000 4,500 4,500 0.02%
Sweden[52] 6,341,000 0.00%
Switzerland[53] 4,210,000 100 100 0.00%
Thailand[54] 15,023,000 5,600 5,600 0.04%
United Kingdom[55] 47,760,000 382,600 67,800 450,400 0.94%
United States[56] 131,028,000 407,300 11,200 418,500 0.32%
Yugoslavia[57] 15,400,000 446,000 514,000 67,000 1,027,000 6.67%
Totals 1,961,839,000 24,456,700 32,327,100 5,754,000 62,537,800 3.19%

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

While i would never denigrate the sacrifice of those who died, the US contribution to WW2, while relevant, hardly scarred the national psyche to the extent it did to most European nations.]

So what: we weren't talking scarring, we were talking about whether or not american troops could cut the mustard in sustained land fighting.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties

Your wikipedia chart is fucked up. Look at Brazil. It has 1,000 deaths, for a total of 2,000 deaths.

For India, it has 1.5 million civilian deaths (!), but the footnote says this:

"Total deaths were 87,040 which included Army (79,326), Air Force (897), Navy (501), Merchant Navy (6,114), unidentified by branch of service(9), and civilian deaths(193)."

You should start being a little bit sceptical about things you read on the internet.

 

[newharper]

Your wikipedia chart is fucked up. Look at Brazil. It has 1,000 deaths, for a total of 2,000 deaths.

Well I looked that one up and,

↑ Brazil
The Brazilian Expeditionary Force war dead were 510[1,255], Navy losses in the Battle of the Atlantic were 492. Civilian losses due to attacks on merchant shipping were 470 merchant mariners and 502 passengers.[16,540]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties#fn_Ellis

Otherwise, I have no doubt of the American grunt's ability to kill people, but of the stomach to take american casualities in the general public.

They appear to have no such qualms as to the victims of their agression.

 

[moono]

JC;

You set up a premise in the first paragraph, then shoot it down yourself in the second.

Are you just stuck for something to say, or what ? I did no such thing.

 

[Barking_Mad]

No, you said americans were killing people from 20,000 feet at the click of a button, and I'm saying you're full of shit.

*ahem*

Afghan children die as US drops one-tonne bombs

Nine civilians, including four children, were killed in Afghanistan when US planes dropped two 2,000lb bombs on their mud home. Their deaths came after at least eight civilians were killed by US Marines a day earlier.

 

[nino_savatte]

Prove what I said to be wrong.

This is wrong.

Maybe that's why the Sunnis wanted to take over the place in the first instance.

Your 'analysis' overlooks some important facts: such as why the Sunnis formed the so-called 'elite' and the secular nature of the country prior to the invasion and Britain's role in its formation (including the rapid drive from Basra to Mosul in around a week in 1917)

Your knowledge of Iraq's history is cursory at best, a narrative at worst.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Of course, these bombs only destroy buildings and kill terrorists....

A review of military data shows that daily bombing runs and jet-missile launches have increased by more than 50 percent in the past five months, compared with the same period last year. Knight Ridder's statistical findings were reviewed and confirmed by American Air Force officials in the region.

The numbers also show that US forces dropped bombs on more cities during the last five months than they did during the same period a year ago. Air strikes hit at least 11 cities between Oct. 1, 2004, and Feb. 28, 2005, but were mostly concentrated in and around the western city of Fallujah. A year later, US warplanes struck at least 22 cities during the same months.

....

The statistics show that US and coalition planes dropped bombs or missiles on Iraqi cities on at least 76 days from Oct. 1, 2005, through Feb. 28, 2006 - or one out of every two days. During the same period a year earlier, bombs or missiles struck on only 49 days, the tabulation showed.

Bombs were dropped on more days in each of the last five months than they were for the same months the previous year. For example, the US military launched bombings and missile strikes on 20 days in December 2005, compared with 12 in December 2004, and 10 in January 2006, compared with five in January 2005.

www.truthout.org/docs_2006/031506A.shtml

The number of airstrikes carried out each month by U.S. aircraft rose almost fivefold this year, from roughly 25 in January to 120 in November, according to a tally provided by the military. Accounts by residents, officials and witnesses in Anbar and the Marines themselves make clear that Iraqi civilians are frequently caught in the attacks.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/23/AR2005122301471.html

 

[Dandred]

No, you said americans were killing people from 20,000 feet at the click of a button, and I'm saying you're full of shit.

Really, so the Americans didn't use laser guided bombs? You are the one who is full of shit...

Fallujah Mosque Bombed by US:
Rocket and 500-Pound, Laser-Guided Bomb

http://www.mindfully.org/Reform/2004/Fallujah-Mosque-Bombed7apr04.htm

 

[Dandred]

Originally Posted by Johnny Canuck2
No, you said americans were killing people from 20,000 feet at the click of a button, and I'm saying you're full of shit.

*ahem*

Afghan children die as US drops one-tonne bombs

So Johhny are you sure it's not you full of shit? Idiot.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

*ahem*

Afghan children die as US drops one-tonne bombs

"Coalition forces observed two men with AK-47s [assault rifles] leaving the scene of the rocket attack and entering the compound," said Lt-Col David Accetta, a military spokesman. "These men knowingly endangered civilians by retreating into a populated area while conducting attacks against coalition forces."

The "compound" was a small group of mud houses where Mr Nabi's family lived. The air strikes destroyed the house where the family was, according to reports from the scene."

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

http://www.mnftiu.cc/mnftiu.cc/war62.html

http://www.mnftiu.cc/mnftiu.cc/war61.html

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Really, so the Americans didn't use laser guided bombs? You are the one who is full of shit...

Fallujah Mosque Bombed by US:
Rocket and 500-Pound, Laser-Guided Bomb

http://www.mindfully.org/Reform/2004/Fallujah-Mosque-Bombed7apr04.htm

Once again, the comment was made that the US had no stomach for ground fighting, preferring instead to drop bombs from 20,000 feet. They are in fact involved in ground fighting. As well, in the context, the bombing I was referring to was carpet bombing by B52s, which isn't taking place. Most of the air to ground attacks in Iraq take place at a lower altitude.

 

[Dandred]

Once again, the comment was made that the US had no stomach for ground fighting, preferring instead to drop bombs from 20,000 feet. They are in fact involved in ground fighting. As well, in the context, the bombing I was referring to was carpet bombing by B52s, which isn't taking place. Most of the air to ground attacks in Iraq take place at a lower altitude.

You seem to be wriggling more than usual here. People can all read what you have written before hand.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Once again, the comment was made that the US had no stomach for ground fighting, preferring instead to drop bombs from 20,000 feet. They are in fact involved in ground fighting. As well, in the context, the bombing I was referring to was carpet bombing by B52s, which isn't taking place. Most of the air to ground attacks in Iraq take place at a lower altitude.

Dandred didn't mention carpet bombing, you did. You also said,

No, you said americans were killing people from 20,000 feet at the click of a button, and I'm saying you're full of shit.

So i posted an article that showed they were.

 

[nino_savatte]

http://www.mnftiu.cc/mnftiu.cc/war62.html

http://www.mnftiu.cc/mnftiu.cc/war61.html

More links posted without any comment from you. Quelle surprise.

You're digging yourself quite a hole here, Johnny boy.

 

[nino_savatte]

"Coalition forces observed two men with AK-47s [assault rifles] leaving the scene of the rocket attack and entering the compound," said Lt-Col David Accetta, a military spokesman. "These men knowingly endangered civilians by retreating into a populated area while conducting attacks against coalition forces."

The "compound" was a small group of mud houses where Mr Nabi's family lived. The air strikes destroyed the house where the family was, according to reports from the scene."

Mair plagiarism fae Urban's ace dissembler...and it's no even referenced. Typique.

 

[TAE]

"Coalition forces observed two men with AK-47s [assault rifles] leaving the scene of the rocket attack and entering the compound," said Lt-Col David Accetta, a military spokesman. "These men knowingly endangered civilians by retreating into a populated area while conducting attacks against coalition forces."

The "compound" was a small group of mud houses where Mr Nabi's family lived. The air strikes destroyed the house where the family was, according to reports from the scene."

What is that meant to prove exactly ?

 

[denniseagle]

That's how the Sunni and the Shia are fighting each other - they're fighting the Americans with roadside bombs.

How does fighting each other equal fighting the 'Americans?'

Will some one please answer the question as to whether sunni and shiia co-exist elsewhere.

 

[Aldebaran]

Will some one please answer the question as to whether sunni and shiia co-exist elsewhere.

Of course. (do you htink we all ocnstantly slit each other's troaths?) and they did in Iraq where mixed villages, neighborhoods, marriages are not only common, but not even *thought* about as "special" before all this started.

All this talk about "sectarian" violence is only to hide the simple fact that is has less to do with religious differences, then it has with political goals.
Of course, the more bloodshed on both sides - and don't forget all the other factors: ethnical, tribal, regional, influx of foreigners with each their own agenda, that are or become intertwined with it - the more it gets indeed focussed on this most "visible" factor, exploited by the US to drive and "explain" what they themselves created.

salaam.

 

[Aldebaran]

All the ridiculous fools who claim that dropping tons of bombs on cities, towns, villages, single rural homes doesn't fall under "killing people from 20000 feet" (or no matter which considerable distance, making the attackers out of reach of those they come to murder) must try to survive a bomb/rocket/whatever while it drops and explodes on their head.


salaam.

 

[Aldebaran]

By the way: You can also go to visit the homeless now living in cabans or rag-tents in Baghdad and ask why they aren't at home. I suspect a fair amount of those people can give you a detailed description of the result of US cowardice.
You can conduct the same easy research all over Iraq. Next you can wait for being hit yourself to get the "life experience". Then see if you still can go back home, turn on your PC and write about your experiences on this board.
See you when you come back.

salaam.

 

[moono]

Well said.

Yep, embracing the Idiot Son is going to be a toughie.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Of course. (do you htink we all ocnstantly slit each other's troaths?) and they did in Iraq where mixed villages, neighborhoods, marriages are not only common, but not even *thought* about as "special" before all this started.

All this talk about "sectarian" violence is only to hide the simple fact that is has less to do with religious differences, then it has with political goals.
Of course, the more bloodshed on both sides - and don't forget all the other factors: ethnical, tribal, regional, influx of foreigners with each their own agenda, that are or become intertwined with it - the more it gets indeed focussed on this most "visible" factor, exploited by the US to drive and "explain" what they themselves created.

salaam.

Then why did Saddam find it necessary to suppress the shiite religion in Iraq?

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

By the way: You can also go to visit the homeless now living in cabans or rag-tents in Baghdad and ask why they aren't at home. I suspect a fair amount of those people can give you a detailed description of the result of US cowardice.
You can conduct the same easy research all over Iraq. Next you can wait for being hit yourself to get the "life experience". Then see if you still can go back home, turn on your PC and write about your experiences on this board.
See you when you come back.

salaam.

Only problem with your theory is that now most Iraqis are being killed by other iraqis.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Only problem with your theory is that now most Iraqis are being killed by other iraqis.

If you destroy the apparatus of the state, even if it was a rather shitty state, you are accountable for what happens next.

Particularly if you are for reasons of your own, trying to bring about sectarian conflicts in the resulting aftermath.