View Full Version : Moving Overseas??
KeyboardJockey
09-07-2007, 10:52
Anyone here done it? Anyone here gone to an ‘unsafe’ part of the world and did OK?
How long would you recommend staying in a country as a visitor to see if you like it before committing oneself to stay permanently?
What about contact with family and friends?
Its something I’m considering for about 5 years time moving to the middle east with my partner. I know the culture shock is going to be huge.
What are the pitfalls and bonuses?
Got lots of confused questions because this has only recently come up as an issue.
waverunner
10-07-2007, 20:57
I'd stay at least a couple months to get the feel of the place - you still won't know everything obviously, but you can tell within that time IMO if the place is right for you.
Contact with family and friends always tends to fall a bit when you're in a different country but it won't matter, you will make new friends and your family and true friends from home will always be there, contact or no contact.
Pitfalls are a lack of support system, lack of knowledge of bureaucracy, policies etc (that can take years to learn), feeling homesick, needing to learn a new language possibly (though this is equal pitfall equal bonus)
Bonuses are you develop as a person.. embedding yourself in a foreign culture is a fantastic learning experience and can really open your eyes. You'll probably be delighted by some things and horrified by others, but even the things you find terrible.. you'll learn to see things from their POV even if you don't agree.
That's all I can think of right now.
KeyboardJockey
11-07-2007, 08:21
I'd stay at least a couple months to get the feel of the place - you still won't know everything obviously, but you can tell within that time IMO if the place is right for you.
I'm looking to visit for a three week period but where I'm going is going to be a total and utter culture shock. I'm totally unused to the sight of civilians walking round with firearms for example.
Taking a few months off as paid leave would be impossible but I might be able to take time off without pay and find a temp job in my destination. I think what could be possible would be an initial visit and if I don't get blown up, shot, stabbed or deported I'll go for the longer stay.
Contact with family and friends always tends to fall a bit when you're in a different country but it won't matter, you will make new friends and your family and true friends from home will always be there, contact or no contact.
I think the web makes this a lot easier these days. I could always fly my parents out if they wanted to visit.
Pitfalls are a lack of support system, lack of knowledge of bureaucracy, policies etc (that can take years to learn), feeling homesick, needing to learn a new language possibly (though this is equal pitfall equal bonus)
Yup I agree. I've been told horrific tales about the level of beauracracy in my intended destination. Language and just general cultural stuff like manners and what is expected will be some of my pitfalls. There is support available but a lot of it has to be done by the individual. Driving will be scary everyone warns me about driving there.
Bonuses are you develop as a person.. embedding yourself in a foreign culture is a fantastic learning experience and can really open your eyes. You'll probably be delighted by some things and horrified by others, but even the things you find terrible.. you'll learn to see things from their POV even if you don't agree.
I certainly agree that there will be things that delight me and things that horrify me. Part of my family moved to Brazil and they want to come back because of the appalling way that the Brazilians treat children. I'm certainly not going to get involved in any rows about politics over there far too dangerous to do that.
That's all I can think of right now.
Thank you its really helpful.
I lived in Saudia Arabia Yamboo, Jeddeh and Ryad for 1 year and Bahrain for another, have quite few stories :D
ATOMIC SUPLEX
11-07-2007, 09:04
Anyone here done it? Anyone here gone to an ‘unsafe’ part of the world and did OK?
.
I moved to Birmingham once but moved all my stuff back to Bath two days later.
Yuck.
KeyboardJockey
11-07-2007, 09:04
I lived in Saudia Arabia Yamboo, Jeddeh and Ryad for 1 year and Bahrain for another, have quite few stories :D
That must have been an experience :eek:
KeyboardJockey
11-07-2007, 09:07
I moved to Birmingham once but moved all my stuff back to Bath two days later.
Yuck.
Fuck me I knew brum was bad but not that bad. :D
ATOMIC SUPLEX
11-07-2007, 09:12
Well I didn't like it at all, but then I'm a classy fella.
KeyboardJockey
11-07-2007, 09:17
Well I didn't like it at all, but then I'm a classy fella.
Like me too classy for Dagenham which is why I now live in posh Bounds Green.
I moved to Birmingham once but moved all my stuff back to Bath two days later. Ponce!
ATOMIC SUPLEX
11-07-2007, 10:50
and proud.
Prole!
Anyone here done it? Anyone here gone to an ‘unsafe’ part of the world and did OK?
How long would you recommend staying in a country as a visitor to see if you like it before committing oneself to stay permanently?
What about contact with family and friends?
Its something I’m considering for about 5 years time moving to the middle east with my partner. I know the culture shock is going to be huge.
What are the pitfalls and bonuses?
Got lots of confused questions because this has only recently come up as an issue.I lived for 9 months on the piece of stolen land you're thinking of going to. I really don't understand why anyone would move from the UK to there. If, or more likely when, the geopolitical situation changes drastically in the next few decades your kids could find themselves in a serious trap. And don't you think about your conscience? - you could well be on another family's land, in their house even.
and proud.
Prole!I was once. But still a Brummie :D
KeyboardJockey
11-07-2007, 10:58
I want to be absolutely sure that I can cope with where I may be going. Turning round and coming back is not something I really want to do. One of my Dads friends was a 'ten pound pom' and they managed to only last about three months before they had to get back on the ship and come back because they hated Australia, the weather, the people etc etc.
Have you ever been to Israel?
KeyboardJockey
11-07-2007, 11:01
I lived for 9 months on the piece of stolen land you're thinking of going to. I really don't understand why anyone would move from the UK to there. If, or more likely when, the geopolitical situation changes drastically in the next few decades your kids could find themselves in a serious trap. And don't you think about your conscience? - you could well be on another family's land, in their house even.
Not going to the stolen bit going to the legit bit. :D There are plenty of cross community organisations working for peace which I would like to be involved in. I think if you are going to go to an area like that then you have a responsibility to try to make things better rather than the Yanks in the West Bank settlements who only make things worse.
KeyboardJockey
11-07-2007, 11:03
Have you ever been to Israel?
Going for the first time next year. The idea of moving came up in a convo with partner the other day but I wouldn't want to move there without spending some time there first. It is going to be a culture shock.
Not going to the stolen bit going to the legit bit. :D No such thing
KeyboardJockey
11-07-2007, 11:09
No such thing
Oh yes there is! (Not going to turn this into a political row). Check your maps, UN information etc etc.
There is no way on earth would I want to live on the West Bank with a bunch of gun toting Yank extremists and an occupied population. Would much rather live in Israel proper near the Med. If I move there that is.
Where did you stay?
I was on Kibbutzes, one near Petah Tikva but mostly in the north just in from Nahariya. Why do you want to go there? So many Israelis want to get out
The maps, UN lines mean nothing to the people who left or were driven from their homes as refugees and were barred from returning. Unlike them, you can just waltz in and set up home, possibly on top of theirs. I saw lots of ruined houses and villages.
KeyboardJockey
11-07-2007, 11:26
I was on Kibbutzes, one near Petah Tikva but mostly in the north just in from Nahariya. Why do you want to go there? So many Israelis want to get out
I've never lived abroad in a place like that and I'd like to try. I know what you mean about people wanting to get out and away from the terrorism and uncertainty I've met a few Israeli nationals over here who've done that. From what I've found out Petah Tikvah sounds like quite a dynamic place business and services wise is that correct?
The maps, UN lines mean nothing to the people who left or were driven from their homes as refugees and were barred from returning. Unlike them, you can just waltz in and set up home, possibly on top of theirs. I saw lots of ruined houses and villages.
There was a lot of tragedies surrounding the creation of the state, tragedies and atrocities on both sides. This is not the time or the place to debate them.
I've never lived abroad in a place like that and I'd like to try. I know what you mean about people wanting to get out and away from the terrorism and uncertainty I've met a few Israeli nationals over here who've done that. From what I've found out Petah Tikvah sounds like quite a dynamic place business and services wise is that correct? It's 20 years since I was there. It was just a scruffy town then. I was glad to get out of there to go to the north
There was a lot of tragedies surrounding the creation of the state, tragedies and atrocities on both sides. This is not the time or the place to debate them.You can try telling me what you'd like me to talk about and when, but as this is a public board, you're wasting your breath. You can dress things up any way you like, but people left thier homes as refugees and have not been allowed to return to them. Meanwhile you can just stroll in. Nice
I loved my time in Israel. Lived and worked with communities of all persuasions over 6 years. I learned a lot:
About the prejudices of some people back in the UK who shoot their mouths off once they know where you are working.
I learned to talk to people, deal with my own assumptions and to be culturally sensitive. People anywhere dont take kindly to outsiders turning up and shouting the odds about what they think is going on.
Israel will shock and delight you. The politics, the attitudes, the way of life. The country itself is packed full of things to do- political, voluntary, social activity where it actually DOES make a adifference.
More sport, leisure, art, culture and community than you can shake a stick at.
Go with an open mind- its a passionate country and it will amaze you.
Re language- Hebrew is pretty easy to pick up.
Just socialising will have you at conversational level quicker than you think.
If you are in there for the long tern, head for the local Ulpan- a local community college. Do Ulpan aleph and it will familiarise you with the spoken and written alphabet, verbs and grammar. And its free.
Arabic is also widely taught in Ulpans, or go to the community centre/ library and ask there.
Wait till you get your bearings and then go join whatever organisation you want. There is so much difference you can make to whatever community you choose. There is a tremendous history of volunteering- including in Israeli Arab towns and they'd love to have you join them.
I moved to France on my own in 1995.
France would appear to be just next door but the culture shock is still huge.
The main thing i noticed after 4 or 5 years was that i missed my family terribly, even though we dont see each other that much. I also lost touch with most of my friends.
I missed watching english telly, (even tho i dont watch that much) and I started cherishing things like marmite :eek:
All in all tho it was cool and I'm planning to go and live in Asia this winter for a while.
If you can financially move i would not hesitate, i would like to but i have no way to support myself there at the moment. I stayed in France for 3-4 months which was cool, relying on friends to have some place to sleep only works so long. I am not sure if i would want to move there as it started to feel like home with a different language.
Israel is a pretty wild place. I haven't been in 10 years, but the only living relatives I have (of whom I'm aware, at least) that aren't in the US are in Israel.
There are loads of other places I'd rather live, myself, but if I were in your shoes, I'm sure I'd learn a tremendous amount living there if I were willing to remain fully immersed in a state of perpetual and profound ambivalence. I can't imagine doing it any other way, though.
There is tremendous theater, dance, music there and I have many dear friends who live there and have ties there. I think, as an American Jew, my head might explode (to say nothing of all the other explosions with which I might have to content) if I moved there, though. And the landscape is gorgeous.
Re what Spion says - it seems to me that my conscience and a desire to engage with it in a new context would have to be a big part of the reason to live there in the first place.
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