View Full Version : shooting outside macdonalds
traffics all screwed up in case anybodys trying to get home
Fucking hell. Could it be any busier round there?
I mean that as in a busy place to shoot somebody, not as in gosh the traffic's fucked up.
trashpony
28-09-2006, 17:11
I mean that as in a busy place to shoot somebody, not as in gosh the traffic's fucked up.
Yeh right. You're unbelievably callous - we all know :(
currently the 2, 3, 37, 355 etc are all going up brixton hill. so avoid the busses.
no busses are going down.
i hear it may have been a kid that shot someone.
gaijingirl
28-09-2006, 17:15
oh shit. Shit for what's happened and shit 'cos I was about to get on the no.2 bus to Stockwell and I'm running incredibly late!
Brixton doesn't really need this.
WTF are these kids doing with guns...
makes me so.... :mad:
walkssoftly
28-09-2006, 17:20
So, was that the reason for the helecopter I saw desending over the rooftops then?
i belive both police and hems choppers were there. which would imply yes someone was injured.
i've texted a few people at work but no reply yet
aurora green
28-09-2006, 17:28
:(
trashpony
28-09-2006, 17:31
i belive both police and hems choppers were there. which would imply yes someone was injured.
i've texted a few people at work but no reply yet
:(
What's a hems chopper?
Helicopter Emergency Medical Service
Helicopter Emergency Medical Service - the ambulance sevice's helicopter that lands on the roof of the royal london. its bright red and sponsored by virgin.
carries a paramedic, doctor and pilot and can get anywhere within the M25 in 12 minutes.
RushcroftRoader
28-09-2006, 17:39
Shootings coming thick and fast at the moment. Hope this is not the start of something.
trashpony
28-09-2006, 17:40
Helicopter Emergency Medical Service - the ambulance sevice's helicopter that lands on the roof of the royal london. its bright red and sponsored by virgin.
That's the one that lands in Ruskin Park by my sister's house. I always worry because there's usually loads of kids running round excitedly when it comes down - I'm scared they'll get blown away or squashed or something
What was it over this time, I wonder?
£100 worth of nasty drugs, or maybe one of them looked at the other one in a funny way? Definitely worth killing someone over either way!
Pathetic.
Giles..
That's the one that lands in Ruskin Park by my sister's house. I always worry because there's usually loads of kids running round excitedly when it comes down - I'm scared they'll get blown away or squashed or something
I thought the whole area was a constant hot crime scene when I first moved here, before I clocked it was an air ambulance :o
Ah that explains it - just had to walk home as the buses are diverted. The Police are stopping any traffic going down Acre Lane towards Brixton, presumably to stop complete gridlock. Everything's being directed down Kings Avenue instead...
trashpony
28-09-2006, 17:58
I thought the whole area was a constant hot crime scene when I first moved here, before I clocked it was an air ambulance :o
:D
I'm sure I'd have thought the same thing only you can actually see it land from the upstairs windows at my sister's place
just got a txt simply saying 'shooting' which prolly means they've been a bit busy with it.
By Christ I'm getting bored with these pathetic cunts and their fucking guns.
Still another new yellow 'shooting incident' board will match the two others further along Coldharbour Lane.
Dubversion
28-09-2006, 18:16
Ah that explains it - just had to walk home as the buses are diverted. The Police are stopping any traffic going down Acre Lane towards Brixton, presumably to stop complete gridlock. Everything's being directed down Kings Avenue instead...
innit :(
just took me 45 minutes to get a cab from Kennington to Streatham Hill. :(
Agent Sparrow
28-09-2006, 18:23
OMG, got home about half an hour ago and wondered why that part was all taped off. :(
innit :(
just took me 45 minutes to get a cab from Kennington to Streatham Hill. :(
U poor thing..callous doesn't begin to describe that
How inconvenient for everyone! :rolleyes:
I hope the shooting victim is OK :(
Dubversion
28-09-2006, 18:32
U poor thing..callous doesn't begin to describe that
oh fuck off, i wasn't equating my inconvenience with someone being fucking shot, i was agreeing with the degree of disruption.
sanctimonious bitch
Agent Sparrow
28-09-2006, 18:33
Um, before this thread descends into bunfights I'm sure it's possible for people to be shocked and saddenned by the shooting and also to comment on the disruption to the area. It's not like anyone has said the shooting was inconsiderate in re: to transport, unlike some responses I've heard on the tube when some poor bugger has ended up under a train. :(
Um, before this thread descends into bunfights I'm sure it's possible for people to be shocked and saddenned by the shooting and also to comment on the disruption to the area. It's not like anyone has said the shooting was inconsiderate in re: to transport, unlike some responses I've heard on the tube when some poor bugger has ended up under a train. :(
I think it is very selfish for people to throw themselves under trains at peak commuting times. It's all very well for them, they're dead in a few seconds, but what about everyone else? Not to mention the poor driver.
Giles..
Dubversion
28-09-2006, 18:38
Um, before this thread descends into bunfights I'm sure it's possible for people to be shocked and saddenned by the shooting and also to comment on the disruption to the area. It's not like anyone has said the shooting was inconsiderate in re: to transport, unlike some responses I've heard on the tube when some poor bugger has ended up under a train. :(
quite. i don't care about the length of the journey, it's just a good barometer of quite how much disruption has been caused. Takes a particularly sneering mentality to assume otherwise.
We'll have the inevitable 'revenge shootings' to look forward to now too...
:(
It's all very well for them, they're dead in a few seconds, but what about everyone else?
actually many survive much longer than a few seconds and have full realisation that a tube is on top of their mangled body. many dont die
memespring
28-09-2006, 19:00
its all getting a bit mental round here isnt it - the worry is starts becoming more common place, more people carry guns, more shootings, all very sad.
It's all very worrying. What with the double shooting at the Fridge on Monday what's next? :(
the school down the end of our road had to be shut early on police advice last friday, suppsoedly some shooting was planned or something, along with another in peckham, and there's rumours going round the teenager's school that their school is mixed up in it (but you know what kids can be like for rumours, it's still worrying though)
i managed to avoid brixton - usually get the 37 but got a tip off from the missus and got the 345 round that way. could see the blue lights in the distance as i went over to gresham road. hope whoever got shot isn't too badly hurt. and hope they get the fucker who did it :(
Agent Sparrow
28-09-2006, 19:20
I think it is very selfish for people to throw themselves under trains at peak commuting times. It's all very well for them, they're dead in a few seconds, but what about everyone else? Not to mention the poor driver.
Giles..
1) not all people who end up under trains were committing suicide
2) the whole debate about suicide and selfishness is quite involved, and tbh when someone is so desperate they are driven to take their own life I'm not sure if we can judge them by the same standards we'd use to describe other actions of selfishness. If we would then loved ones are pretty high up there as people justified in feeling angry, and yes, I concede the driver of the train. If commuters get caught up in the "they're so inconsiderate" debate for having their journey delayed by half an hour then frankly they can go fuck themselves IMO. :)
walkssoftly
28-09-2006, 19:32
Just reported on LBC radio, 18 year old boy was shot inside McDs, taken to hospital, unknown if he's survived.....
TonkaToy
28-09-2006, 19:33
1) not all people who end up under trains were committing suicide
2) the whole debate about suicide and selfishness is quite involved, and tbh when someone is so desperate they are driven to take their own life I'm not sure if we can judge them by the same standards we'd use to describe other actions of selfishness. If we would then loved ones are pretty high up there as people justified in feeling angry, and yes, I concede the driver of the train. If commuters get caught up in the "they're so inconsiderate" debate for having their journey delayed by half an hour then frankly they can go fuck themselves IMO. :)
In Japan the mess is cleared up within minutes.
memespring
28-09-2006, 19:50
Just left the pub and the last cop car had gone. Really crap if its just a kid. :(
William of Walworth
28-09-2006, 20:28
Just seen this, dreadful. :( :(
I hope the lad survives and the twat with the gun gets caught.
And that no-one even dreams of trying to argue that it would have been less likely to happen if more people had the 'right to bear arms' in 'self defence' :mad:
It's up on the BBC now. 2 people shot: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/5390652.stm"The venue was very busy at the time of the shooting and those present - including families with young children - were shocked and terrified by this violent attack.
"We have only a brief description of the gunman at present - he was black and approximately 6ft 1in tall - but if anyone saw the incident or the suspect making off, we need to hear from you."
Police said the suspect ran down nearby Rushcroft Road and into Saltoun Road, heading towards Railton Road. Must have been terrifying for the families.
dogmatique
28-09-2006, 20:37
And how petty an argument it must have been. Two seventeen year olds? Geez. Dem must have shown a lack of respeck, innit.
i would be most suprised if McD didnt have fully working CCTV
phildwyer
28-09-2006, 20:56
That McDonalds sells more gear than burgers.
i would be most suprised if McD didnt have fully working CCTV
Not to mention Crispy's webcam.
There's been a funny 'vibe' around Brixton for a couple of weeks now. For the first time in my years of living here I've felt nervous and really hyper aware of whats happening about me. I had thought I'd finally reached middle age, but maybe not.
Boo to guns and 'respect'
yeah since we decided to move i've been really conscious about the vibe in brixton being weird. i thought i'd see everything great about brixton but actually its pissing me off and i cant wait for a break.
which is a shame as i've lived here for over 20 years and grown up here.
Not to mention Crispy's webcam.
in fact from MD to to windrush sq is probably on CCTV.
RaverDrew
28-09-2006, 21:23
That McDonalds sells more gear than burgers.
not true
not even near the truth
shooting up in the toilets, yes.
random nutters poncing a quid, yes.
dealing, little or nothing, the place is too hot.
not true
not even near the truth
shooting up in the toilets, yes.
random nutters poncing a quid, yes.
dealing, little or nothing, the place is too hot.
this is what the ignore button is for ;)
btw in my first post i wasnt being off by just putting it was disrupting traffic - its just i had absolutely no other details and with stuff like this speculation is futile (the truth is normally more chillling)
trashpony
28-09-2006, 21:32
this is what the ignore button is for ;)
I've said this before but I'll say it again - you are wise beyond your years :cool:
Is there anyone left who doesn't have dwyer on ignore?
Just walked by there on my way back.
The McDonalds side is still cordoned off. I stood chatting to a woman PC, apparantly it was a double shooting inside McD's, when the unbelievable happened.
A bloke in a suit in his 40s herein after labelled Mr Fuckwit approached the PC.
Mr Fuckwit: I say, is it really necessary to cordon off the whole road? It's an awful nuisance!
PC: I'm afraid with this type of incident it is, sir.
Mr Fuckwit: But that side of the road isn't cordoned off!
PC: That is because the double-shooting happened in McDonalds, sir.
Mr Fuckwit: Well, it's very inconvenient!
I said, listen mate if god forbid you get shot we won't bother doing anything, alright with you? As he walked off muttering.
The PC said my sentiments exactly, sir ;) I think I pulled.
kidtripod
28-09-2006, 22:21
It's odd some of you have mentioned a strange vibe to the place, as a few weeks ago an old colleague of mine that had lived here for 10 years moved out of the area after an unfortunate incident, the nature of which I didn't quite get, but it clearly upset him a lot.
I'm certainly feeling that the life is being sucked out of the main town area now. Things seem to shut down and have nothing open in their place. I hope it's just a phase.
:(
What the fuck was this one all about? 'You calling my burger a batty bwoy?'
Treebeard
28-09-2006, 22:49
It's odd some of you have mentioned a strange vibe to the place, as a few weeks ago an old colleague of mine that had lived here for 10 years moved out of the area after an unfortunate incident, the nature of which I didn't quite get, but it clearly upset him a lot.
I'm certainly feeling that the life is being sucked out of the main town area now. Things seem to shut down and have nothing open in their place. I hope it's just a phase.
Sorry - I don't want you to get defensive here, but what places have closed down and not reopened as something else? It's just that everywhere I look, from the renovations at Loughborough Junction, to the buildings opposite the Moorlands, to the tube exterior, to new restaurants and bars on Railton, I see only investment and an improving outlook. This is a glitch, and the two incidents (Fridge on Monday and McD's) are completely unrelated, the former being linked to triad gangs. I'm not saying any of this is welcome or that it doesn't worry me cus it does, but they're will be ups and downs on the way to a hopefully better Brixton.
Wednesdayite
28-09-2006, 22:53
The amount of shouting, arguments, screaming etc I hear from my bedroom window (Tunstall Rd backing onto Brighton Terrace) has got much worse over the last year. We do seem to be approaching a spike in activity, I agree that the weird vibe is back. It almost feels like when I lived up North Brixton (north of the then Bar Lorca) about three years ago. They never even cleaned Kevon Forsythe's blood up properly from inside the doorway of my local off licence.
For a while, I was scared to go out my front door. I used to wake up in the morning occasionally to hear the absolute silence of Brixton Road having been cordoned off.
I have a feeling it will be a bad winter.
Firing in rush-hour McD's? There must be one seriously unhinged bastard out there.
Treebeard
28-09-2006, 23:05
...or another kid into some pish rapper who glamourises it.
brixtonvilla
28-09-2006, 23:33
That McDonalds sells more gear than burgers.
Got some evidence for that, have y...
*re-reads poster's username*
*shuts up*
gaijingirl
29-09-2006, 01:07
Not sure if this has been posted up before?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/5390652.stm
I have to say I haven't noticed this bad vibe in Brixton myself. :confused: Obviously I'm aware of the latest spate of shootings, but to my mind it hasn't really affected the vibe on the high road.
Although to be fair, it's not like I'm down there every day. I go down maybe 4x a week and cycle straight through the other days.
I think we should all remain positive about Brixton though. To my mind a lot of negative feelings can be self fulfilling. I love it here and I think, like anywhere else, it has it's ups and downs.
That McDonalds sells more gear than burgers.Your habit of posting up trolling bollocks in the Brixton forum really has gone beyond joke, especially when the subject matter is so serious.
Anyway, back on topic:
Two teenagers have been shot in front of families with young children in a McDonald's restaurant.I *really* hope the culprit(s) gets caught in double quick time because the cunt clearly has no respect for the people of Brixton.
Not sure if this has been posted up before?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/5390652.stm
I have to say I haven't noticed this bad vibe in Brixton myself. :confused: Obviously I'm aware of the latest spate of shootings, but to my mind it hasn't really affected the vibe on the high road.
Although to be fair, it's not like I'm down there every day. I go down maybe 4x a week and cycle straight through the other days.
I think we should all remain positive about Brixton though. To my mind a lot of negative feelings can be self fulfilling. I love it here and I think, like anywhere else, it has it's ups and downs.
actually i was thinking about it overnight and i suspect my feelings recently have something to do with the huge numbers of opposing school kids facing up every day at the bus stops and shrieking endlessly about nothing
i'm sure once the new term really gets started it will calm down as usual.
goldenecitrone
29-09-2006, 08:14
That's scary. Executing people in the middle of a busy restaurant in the early evening. Very sad for Brixton.:(
This is a glitch, and the two incidents (Fridge on Monday and McD's) are completely unrelated, the former being linked to triad gangs.
Are you 100% sure they are unconnected though? My first thought when I heard about it was that it could all be part of another pointless gang war, as this seemed to be an execution style shooting.
I get on the bus from Wandsworth to Brixton about once a week in the afternoon, and practically every time there seems to be some sort of trouble involving teenage boys.
kidtripod
29-09-2006, 08:48
Sorry - I don't want you to get defensive here, but what places have closed down and not reopened as something else?
Just as an example I find it hard to justify going to pubs in Brixton now, there appears to have been an atmospheric shift. I've been in some recently to find they're ghost pubs for no apparent reason. There was a good deal of initial reaction stuff in that post as well.
My concern over these two incidents is that they will do a combination of scaring people into staying in (which appears to be worse now than say a year ago) and justifying the shutting down of any "problem" establishments for good, until eventually there's none left. The whole business with the schools shutting early the other week just looks bizarre now.
trashpony
29-09-2006, 08:50
Are you 100% sure they are unconnected though? My first thought when I heard about it was that it could all be part of another pointless gang war, as this seemed to be an execution style shooting.
I get on the bus from Wandsworth to Brixton about once a week in the afternoon, and practically every time there seems to be some sort of trouble involving teenage boys.
The guys shot at the Fridge were Vietnamese. Not sure about these two. I don't know what's worse - them being related or them being two entirely separate incidents. :(
memespring
29-09-2006, 08:52
I love the fact that the papers automatically albelled it Triad because its Viatmanease - do triads groups even come from there?
The guys shot at the Fridge were Vietnamese. Not sure about these two. I don't know what's worse - them being related or them being two entirely separate incidents. :(
All reminds me abit of Alby Starvation.. - all the hitmen roaming around Brixton. :cool:
All reminds me abit of Alby Starvation.. - all the hitmen roaming around Brixton. :cool:
have ya got a copy of alby starvation??? I lost mine...:(
re: vietnamese triad stuff, my vietnamese friend said most of the chinese take aways were paying some protection money to the triad and most of these shops are run by the vietnamese
re: Brixton weird vibe - it's Brixton - you can't have moved here post 1981 riots thinking the place was all sunshine and roses...:rolleyes:
boozybirdie
29-09-2006, 09:04
Don't think they are related but there is an atmosphere in Brixton at the mo, it kicked off in Fridge bar last night and everyone was on edge. It's not good :(
have ya got a copy of alby starvation??? I lost mine...:(
I am afraid I borrowed mine - in the name of the low consumption lifestyle. :cool:
I am afraid I borrowed mine - in the name of the low consumption lifestyle. :cool:
damm - I lent mine out years ago...never saw it again...:(
linerider
29-09-2006, 09:55
not true
not even near the truth
shooting up in the toilets, yes.
random nutters poncing a quid, yes.
dealing, little or nothing, the place is too hot.
I haven't been in macdonalds for about 6 months,but there were crack dealers in there then.
oh my god I've just agreed with Phildwyer:eek:
ovaltina
29-09-2006, 10:00
I've just moved back to clapham/brixton after 12 years away and am glad this is the exception, not the rule. It's all a bit wild west. I walked past the McD's last night and thought it was a car crash, but no it's another shooting. Hope the police are on top of this.
Dubversion
29-09-2006, 10:03
oh my god I've just agreed with Phildwyer:eek:
don't make a habit of it, we'd have to put you down like a rabid dog.
linerider
29-09-2006, 10:07
don't make a habit of it, we'd have to put you down like a rabid dog.
I'm in a state of total shock and think i'll go and lay down in a darken room until I stop feeling so dirty.
Dubversion
29-09-2006, 10:08
you need one of London's special new badges. ;)
they were all the rage at offline last night. Can you guess what they said? :D
linerider
29-09-2006, 10:11
you need one of London's special new badges. ;)
they were all the rage at offline last night. Can you guess what they said? :D
F.O.D.?
Dubversion
29-09-2006, 10:11
might be. :D
gaijingirl
29-09-2006, 10:12
F.O.D.?
:D :D :D
I saw this on my way to Brixton tube yesterday... Not the actual shooting but the police cordon and people getting loaded onto ambulances. Massive crowd of people staring, assumed it must have been a bus accident or something and walked on (don't like gawping at crime scenes). Didn't notice any air ambulances mind you, although it's possible they used ground ambulances to transport them to somewhere that the helicopter could land.
It was probably over something REALLY IMPORTANT, like, the victim "dissed" the shooter by pushing in the queue for his Big Mac......
linerider
29-09-2006, 10:19
I haven't been in macdonalds for about 6 months,but there were crack dealers in there then.
oh my god I've just agreed with Phildwyer:eek:
It does give a whole new meaning to being asked"do you want coke with your burger?"though.
:rolleyes:
It was probably over something REALLY IMPORTANT, like, the victim "dissed" the shooter by pushing in the queue for his Big Mac......
Thats the law of the street though innit.
What's worrying is that this fucking gun-toting psycho us still on the streets.
RushcroftRoader
29-09-2006, 10:54
Re: the weird vibe. I think its partly due to the fact that now the police have been so successful in shuting down crack houses, the "chaotic" crack addicts are now donig a lot of late night shouting and screaming on the streets instead.
The crack dealers are often not sorting out their customers to the early morning, according to people in the know.
I would be amazed if the two shootings are connected. The Fridge was full of Vietnamese on Sunday night because of a big Vietnamese event at the Academy during the day.
The thought also occured to me that the drugs market might be getting tougher and less lucrative for the dealers, which might be causing more friction between rival gangs. No idea if this is true or not, but throwing it open for discussion.
The worrying question is whether there is a new local source of guns for these guys?
Dave Mullen
29-09-2006, 11:06
Its all happening in Brixton. I was having a quiet pint with a comrade in the beehive last night and in the space of about 20 minutes two fights kicked off.
William of Walworth
29-09-2006, 11:20
This is all dreadful, but I hope I continue my 25 year streak of luck by not witnessing anything violent/fighty anywhere in Brixton tomorrow ....
William of Walworth
29-09-2006, 11:22
Is there anyone left who doesn't have dwyer on ignore?
Worked for me well mainly :o :p
Numbers are growing, too, it seems. I seriously advise it ....
bluestreak
29-09-2006, 11:49
i don't have dwyer on ignore, and i haven't really noticed a weird vibe in brixton recently. but i am a) remarkably tolerant of mr dwyer's little ways, and b) relatively new to brixton.
aurora green
29-09-2006, 12:03
..
The worrying question is whether there is a new local source of guns for these guys?
Yeah, this is what I've been thinking all morning...
Just where are all these guns coming from? How the fuck are teenagers getting hold of them?
I've heard that there was a big rumble on Coldharbour Lane recently, with big gangs slugging it out with baseball bats.
Anyone hear anything?
ChrisFilter
29-09-2006, 12:26
If commuters get caught up in the "they're so inconsiderate" debate for having their journey delayed by half an hour then frankly they can go fuck themselves IMO. :)
I guess I can fuck myself then, because I do see it as inconsiderate. There are much easier ways of killing yourself that don't fuck things up for other people.
Don't get me wrong, I have every sympathy that they're down enough to take their own life, but annoyance at them causing big disruptions and traumatising the driver isn't exclusive to that.
i don't have dwyer on ignore, and i haven't really noticed a weird vibe in brixton recently. but i am a) remarkably tolerant of mr dwyer's little ways, and b) relatively new to brixton.
I haven't noticed any new or particularly weird vibe... in fact I find it all rather jolly, whether passing the skunk weed man in Brixton market or going past the bloke looking for his crack last night which he dropped out of his homemade pipe. :D
Doesn't surprise me, was in there about 2 years ago and two youth gangs started mouthing off at each other...almost came to blows when one lad pulled up his shirt to show he had a gun down his pants....funnily enough the other gang left quick, though thought at the time how many of them would be off to get tooled up asap. Tis all f*cked up one big ol vicious circle..can't see it getting anything but worse mind :(
ChrisFilter
29-09-2006, 12:36
Hmm, there is a slight edge, but that's probably as a result of the shootings, not shootings as a result of he edge if that makes sense.
Very, very bad for Brixton though. Was just getting a good reputation and less ignorance and now it's right back at the top of the "rough shit hole list" :(
Very, very bad for Brixton though. Was just getting a good reputation and less ignorance and now it's right back at the top of the "rough shit hole list" :(
Nah, not a chance, Chris.
phildwyer
29-09-2006, 12:42
Re: the weird vibe. I think its partly due to the fact that now the police have been so successful in shuting down crack houses, the "chaotic" crack addicts are now donig a lot of late night shouting and screaming on the streets instead.
I think that's part of Brixton's problem, yes. Even if they don't commit crime, they can certainly be intimidating. I think its an argument for localizing and isolating drug use by allowing it in particular, perhaps even supervized, circumstances--like that alkies compound in Brockwell Park. Don't know if it would work with crack, but it does with heroin users.
Apparently the victim that was "critical" is now "stable", which is good.
Still bloody worrying that someone who shoots two people in a crowded McDonalds at 5:30 in the afternoon is still around though! :eek:
ChrisFilter
29-09-2006, 12:50
Nah, not a chance, Chris.
Judging by comments I've heard on the way to work and actually at work, then I'd say there was every chance!
Tank Girl
29-09-2006, 12:54
I saw this on my way to Brixton tube yesterday... Not the actual shooting but the police cordon and people getting loaded onto ambulances. Massive crowd of people staring, assumed it must have been a bus accident or something and walked on (don't like gawping at crime scenes). Didn't notice any air ambulances mind you, although it's possible they used ground ambulances to transport them to somewhere that the helicopter could land.
I went by on the bus just after it had happened, the air ambulance was parked on the patch of green over the road from st matthews church.
RushcroftRoader
29-09-2006, 13:07
I think the lesson we should take away from all of this is that McDonalds is bad for your health and best avoided!
:p
Doesn't surprise me, was in there about 2 years ago and two youth gangs started mouthing off at each other...almost came to blows when one lad pulled up his shirt to show he had a gun down his pants....If only it had accidentally gone off at that point....
Judging by comments I've heard on the way to work and actually at work, then I'd say there was every chance!
Yes - but in 1 weeks time, 1 months time.. its just today's flash news.
I can't imagine there's gonna be a mass exodus to Tottenham.. for example.
Roadkill
29-09-2006, 13:18
If only it had accidentally gone off at that point....
If only every gun-carrying scally could accidentally shoot their own willy off ...
<sorry, perhaps not the thread for flippant comments>
http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30100-13544788,00.html
McDonald' said the pair had not been queuing for food as previously reported as CCTV footage showed them popping in and out of the restaurant.
ChrisFilter
29-09-2006, 13:29
Yes - but in 1 weeks time, 1 months time.. its just today's flash news.
I can't imagine there's gonna be a mass exodus to Tottenham.. for example.
Nah, I don't mean people who live in the area, but all the Tarquins and Julians will be saying "I knew it was a shithole all along" - it bothers me when people think Brixton is a shithole and whilst it could be a good thing that ignorant fucks think badly of Brixton, it still winds me up when people slag it off and haven't ever been anywhere near it. Apart from Living.
poster342002
29-09-2006, 13:30
I'm getting really sick and tired of all this shit. :mad: :(
I can't imagine there's gonna be a mass exodus to Tottenham.. for example.
Things couldn't get that bad, could they?
Dubversion
29-09-2006, 13:32
Things couldn't get that bad, could they?
it would take a fuck of a lot of shootings in every other part of the country APART from tottenham for that to happen.
It was probably over something REALLY IMPORTANT, like, the victim "dissed" the shooter by pushing in the queue for his Big Mac......
Was talking to my mate last night, apparantly that was exactly what happened when someone was shot dead in McDonalds in Camberwell a while back.
It's the kind of thing that saps the will to live here.
Things couldn't get that bad, could they?
We're talkin' post-apocalyptic here...
Yes - but in 1 weeks time, 1 months time.. its just today's flash news.
I can't imagine there's gonna be a mass exodus to Tottenham.. for example.
I might consider swapping my herne hill/Brixton base for a bit of Tottenham if you can get me either the vicarage by Bruce castle park - 18th house with fantastic metal workgate next to medieval church and large park with 500 year old oak or perhaps the oldest semi-detached house in London. Plus the food is more varied and fresher up there!
:D
poster342002
29-09-2006, 13:43
yeah since we decided to move i've been really conscious about the vibe in brixton being weird. i thought i'd see everything great about brixton but actually its pissing me off and i cant wait for a break.
which is a shame as i've lived here for over 20 years and grown up here.
I've been saying much the same for a while, now. I've lived here since the late 70s, and the last 7 years or so have seen things take a real nosedive from which it just doesn't seem to be recovering. :(
phildwyer
29-09-2006, 13:46
I've been saying much the same for a while, now. I've livedhere since the late 70s, and the last 7 years or so have seen things take a real nosedive from which it just doesn't seem to be recovering. :(
Its purely a matter of economics though. Once property prices go high enough relative to the surrounding areas, you can bet the streets of Brixton will be swept clean.
poster342002
29-09-2006, 13:46
It's odd some of you have mentioned a strange vibe to the place, as a few weeks ago an old colleague of mine that had lived here for 10 years moved out of the area after an unfortunate incident, the nature of which I didn't quite get, but it clearly upset him a lot.
I'm certainly feeling that the life is being sucked out of the main town area now. Things seem to shut down and have nothing open in their place. I hope it's just a phase.
I've noticed this trend across London as a whole for a while, now. Urban decay? I think that's what it was once termed as.
Nah, I don't mean people who live in the area, but all the Tarquins and Julians will be saying "I knew it was a shithole all along" - it bothers me when people think Brixton is a shithole and whilst it could be a good thing that ignorant fucks think badly of Brixton, it still winds me up when people slag it off and haven't ever been anywhere near it. Apart from Living.
Look on the bright side - at least it will stop the gentrification of the area, won't it? ;)
Giles..
poster342002
29-09-2006, 14:00
I haven't noticed any new or particularly weird vibe... in fact I find it all rather jolly, whether passing the skunk weed man in Brixton market or going past the bloke looking for his crack last night which he dropped out of his homemade pipe. :D
Yeah - that scene is just a ball of a warm, inviting atmospheare of freindliness. NOT.
ChrisFilter
29-09-2006, 14:15
Look on the bright side - at least it will stop the gentrification of the area, won't it? ;)
Giles..
I do wonder if a few people might be secretly pleased at the the recent trouble for this exact reason.. :rolleyes:
I do wonder if a few people might be secretly pleased at the the recent trouble for this exact reason.. :rolleyes:
:D Its a funny old world.
ChrisFilter
29-09-2006, 14:20
:D Its a funny old world.
It certainly is, Hollis, it certainly is :)
:D Its a funny old world.You wouldn't get this kind of thing going on in the Cultural Quarter of Wood Green.
Brandy-fuelled arguments over Seurat's painting technique breaking out into mild fisticuffs, perhaps, but with all those Bo-Ho artistes about, most would react to street scuffles by knocking out a few salutary stanzas, or perhaps staging a short play.
Yeah - that scene is just a ball of a warm, inviting atmospheare of freindliness. NOT.
Well, you've lived in the area as long as I have - you kind of switch off from the rough stuff after awhile. As long as no-one bothers you.
You wouldn't get this kind of thing going on in the Cultural Quarter of Wood Green.
Brandy-fuelled arguments over Seurat's painting technique breaking out into mild fisticuffs, perhaps, but with all those Bo-Ho artistes about, most would react to street scuffles by knocking out a few salutary stanzas, or perhaps staging a short play.
I entirely agree. We is a higher class of hoighty-toighty up in the Woode Green environs. :cool:
William of Walworth
29-09-2006, 14:35
I think the lesson we should take away from all of this is that McDonalds is bad for your health and best avoided!
:p
I know I shouldn't but ... :D :p
I entirely agree. We is a higher class of hoighty-toighty up in the Woode Green environs. :cool:
what, the rough bit with the shopping centre then....
Wood Green, the arsehole of north London*
*actually there are worse places.....
RaverDrew
29-09-2006, 14:38
I haven't been in macdonalds for about 6 months,but there were crack dealers in there then.
oh my god I've just agreed with Phildwyer:eek:
All that standing around dealing on the street can be hungry work y'know. ;)
tarannau
29-09-2006, 14:45
I've noticed this trend across London as a whole for a while, now. Urban decay? I think that's what it was once termed as.
As someone else asked kidtripod, where's the physical signs of this process. What shops have shut down in Brixton and haven't been replaced?
TBH, although things have been disrupted by shootings more often recently, the atmosphere doesn't seem markedly different to me, apart from on the bus with the gossiping schoolkids perhaps. I suspect that pubs and venues have felt a little quieter because it was the end of the month, when bank accounts run low. Pubs were heaving for the football on Tues/Wed...
There's always some grim shit going on in Brixton sadly - an acquaintance was stabbed and killed just a couple of weeks back in Brockwell leading to much soulsearching and gossip down the locals- but this stuff's high profile and copyworthy (schoolchildren, triads, nightclubs, McD's). I'm not sure it really is that much worse for the average bod in Brixton, but I think it does compound the reputation of the place to outsiders.
phildwyer
29-09-2006, 14:46
All that standing around dealing on the street can be hungry work y'know. ;)
They're not even eating.
phildwyer
29-09-2006, 14:54
All that standing around dealing on the street can be hungry work y'know. ;)
Anyway, I think this topic is viewed as a bit of a distraction from this thread--I'll PM ya--if you'll empty your box
PacificOcean
29-09-2006, 15:01
I just saw this today in the Standard. Could you imagine 10 years ago that there would be a fatal shooting during the day in McDonalds? And if there was, it would be the top story on every news builten. The sad thing that it doesn't even register today as a news story/tragedy.
TBH, I am glad I moved out of Brixton, as if I want that "vibe" then I hear South Central LA is nice this time of year.
A very sad day for where I was born and bred :(
RaverDrew
29-09-2006, 15:09
Anyway, I think this topic is viewed as a bit of a distraction from this thread--I'll PM ya--if you'll empty your box
phildwyer in anti thread-derailing shocker :eek: ;) :D
phildwyer
29-09-2006, 15:09
phildwyer in anti thread-derailing shocker :eek: ;) :D
Nothing if not public-spirited, me. PM sent.
timothysutton1
29-09-2006, 15:41
More info at Black Information Link (http://www.blink.org.uk/pdescription.asp?key=12734&grp=55&cat=199).
urbanspaceman
29-09-2006, 15:43
I've lived here for 22 years - bought a house and done it up. So I guess I'm one of the hated gentrifiers. But don't worry all you hep cats - Brixton hasn't gentrified - things are still just as cool and edgy and urban as ever. Just the way all the Nathan Barleys on this board like it. The police gave up any pretense of doing the job as soon as Commander Cannabis slackened the reins a little. And they've never bothered to take back control.
I'm sick of the squalor (e.g. the ankle deep fired chicken detritus out the Ritzy), the public urination, the aggressive begging, constant drug dealing, the crackhead twitching and writhing in my front garden all last Sunday afternoon, and the fear of accidentally making eye contact on the street that might be misconstrued.
And Brixton is not a multicultural paradise - it's inhabited by two populations that rarely intersect - young professionals on the way up and through it, and a desperately culturally-degraded underclass, the children of whom are exposed daily to to put it mildly, negative roles models. And who know of nothing else.
If it wasn't for the huge advantage of the Tube, an umbilical that ties Brixton firmly into London as a whole, this place would be a fully-fledged combat zone.
Telegraph Hill looks nice - time to assemble the escape committee.
I've also started questioning why I choose to live here anymore either to be honest...
Pretty much had it with being hassled and whistled at by those fucking idiot oregano salesmen at the bus stops, having my arm grabbed by fucked up crackhead beggars outside the tube, and opening my front door to find someone happily pissing on it. Now we seem to have a new wave of gun crime.
Been spending more time out in east london with mates lately and yeh, am thinking what was once the unthinkable for me and giving up Brixton for the east end.
tarannau
29-09-2006, 15:56
And Brixton is not a multicultural paradise - it's inhabited by two populations that rarely intersect - young professionals on the way up and through it, and a desperately culturally-degraded underclass, the children of whom are exposed daily to to put it mildly, negative roles models. And who know of nothing
Maybe that's true for you (you patronising, reductive arse - 'who know of nothing indeed') but I can guarantee I don't feel the same. I'd love to know which one of the two groups you'd put me and my friends in - 'young professionals' or 'culturally degraded underclass.' It's a winning choice isn't it?
aurora green
29-09-2006, 15:56
Steady on peeps!
I can't believe I live in the same town as some of you.
I've just been having a major dilemma about leaving here and moving to West Norwood, and although the move might still go ahead, my hearts not really in it...
Perhaps on my estate things just aren't so on-top as on the high street, but really I don't recognise this somewhat hysterical picture thats being painted here.
phildwyer
29-09-2006, 15:59
it's inhabited by two populations that rarely intersect - young professionals on the way up and through it, and a desperately culturally-degraded underclass
Sorry, but that's bollocks. The vast majority of Brixtonians fall into neither of these categories. I'm amazed that you could live there for 22 years and retain this impression.
RaverDrew
29-09-2006, 16:04
I don't recognise this somewhat hysterical picture thats being painted here.
Innit, what I was thinkin. :eek:
picking up on a bad vibe on the streets ?
more like picking up bad "vibrancy" on the street.
Anyway, I thought half you yuppies came here to see people get shot, be hip urban dudez, and live somewhere racy. ;)
Dubversion
29-09-2006, 16:06
I've lived here for 22 years - bought a house and done it up. So I guess I'm one of the hated gentrifiers. But don't worry all you hep cats - Brixton hasn't gentrified - things are still just as cool and edgy and urban as ever. Just the way all the Nathan Barleys on this board like it. The police gave up any pretense of doing the job as soon as Commander Cannabis slackened the reins a little. And they've never bothered to take back control.
I'm sick of the squalor (e.g. the ankle deep fired chicken detritus out the Ritzy), the public urination, the aggressive begging, constant drug dealing, the crackhead twitching and writhing in my front garden all last Sunday afternoon, and the fear of accidentally making eye contact on the street that might be misconstrued.
And Brixton is not a multicultural paradise - it's inhabited by two populations that rarely intersect - young professionals on the way up and through it, and a desperately culturally-degraded underclass, the children of whom are exposed daily to to put it mildly, negative roles models. And who know of nothing else.
If it wasn't for the huge advantage of the Tube, an umbilical that ties Brixton firmly into London as a whole, this place would be a fully-fledged combat zone.
Telegraph Hill looks nice - time to assemble the escape committee.
what a heap of over-generalised, stereotype-ridden bullshit
agricola
29-09-2006, 16:15
Sorry, but that's bollocks. The vast majority of Brixtonians fall into neither of these categories. I'm amazed that you could live there for 22 years and retain this impression.
That, and the comments by Dub, Taraunau and some others are spot on.
The problems that have been described are, in all probability, the fault of a very small number (ie: in the low hundreds) of people (mainly between 14 and 25) who are operating as if mugging / drug dealing and gangsterism generally are cool, and who are doing it for their own selfish ends rather than as part of a depressed underclass.
Dubversion
29-09-2006, 16:16
Steady on peeps!
I can't believe I live in the same town as some of you.
I've just been having a major dilemma about leaving here and moving to West Norwood, and although the move might still go ahead, my hearts not really in it...
Perhaps on my estate things just aren't so on-top as on the high street, but really I don't recognise this somewhat hysterical picture thats being painted here.
I feel much safer in Brixton of an evening than I used to in places like Poole - full of pissed up lads and squaddies looking for a ruck.
Much as it doesn't make young people dying any more palatable, this violence is rarely random.
but really I don't recognise this somewhat hysterical picture thats being painted here.
Yer, I was much more worried when the man randomly attacked the cyclist with a machete outside MacDonalds in Camberwell....
we never hear much about the gun problems in Nottingham and Leicester....
linerider
29-09-2006, 16:31
Sorry, but that's bollocks. The vast majority of Brixtonians fall into neither of these categories. I'm amazed that you could live there for 22 years and retain this impression.
Help,I've agreed with Phildwyer twice in one day.
Dub will have me put down as a rabid dog. :(
William of Walworth
29-09-2006, 16:32
As I said in an earlier post, in many many years of visiting Brixton (and since 1991, from nearby -- so quite often) I've never encountered any significantly bad shit. OK call me lucky perhaps.
I agree with aurora though -- some people in this thread are painting an exaggerated, near hysterical even, picture ("South Central LA" indeed :rolleyes: ) that doesn't for me and others who know Brixton better, conform with the usually much more humdrum reality.
Not in denial that's there's been some bad shit going on and Rushcroft Roader earlier suggested one or two reasons why conflict is going to be more apparant on the street at the moment than it was a while back.
But what proportion of Brixton residents and visitors actually witness it, and how often?
Not wanting to minimise how terrible a shooting is when it does happen, nor do I want to belittle any victim's bad experience. But people should try and see the overall scene in perspective, and be informed by the insights of residents ...
Orang Utan
29-09-2006, 16:37
Brixton can be grim - last Saturday morning, I saw a crack whore wanking a trampy fellow off in the phone booth opposite the tube station. Which was nice.
ChrisFilter
29-09-2006, 16:41
Brixton can be grim - last Saturday morning, I saw a crack whore wanking a trampy fellow off in the phone booth opposite the tube station. Which was nice.
Sorry about that.. I was really pissed and she was cheap.
I've lived here for 22 years - bought a house and done it up. So I guess I'm one of the hated gentrifiers. But don't worry all you hep cats - Brixton hasn't gentrified - things are still just as cool and edgy and urban as ever. Just the way all the Nathan Barleys on this board like it. The police gave up any pretense of doing the job as soon as Commander Cannabis slackened the reins a little. And they've never bothered to take back control.
I'm sick of the squalor (e.g. the ankle deep fired chicken detritus out the Ritzy), the public urination, the aggressive begging, constant drug dealing, the crackhead twitching and writhing in my front garden all last Sunday afternoon, and the fear of accidentally making eye contact on the street that might be misconstrued.
And Brixton is not a multicultural paradise - it's inhabited by two populations that rarely intersect - young professionals on the way up and through it, and a desperately culturally-degraded underclass, the children of whom are exposed daily to to put it mildly, negative roles models. And who know of nothing else.
If it wasn't for the huge advantage of the Tube, an umbilical that ties Brixton firmly into London as a whole, this place would be a fully-fledged combat zone.
Telegraph Hill looks nice - time to assemble the escape committee.
This post seems fairly accurate to me. I've lived around here for 8 years and basically agree that the squalor, begging, crack epidemic and failure by the police to do anything about it have become totally out of control. Let's face it it's a shithole.
memespring
29-09-2006, 16:47
This post seems fairly accurate to me. I've lived around here for 8 years and basically agree that the squalor, begging, crack epidemic and failure by the police to do anything about it have become totally out of control. Let's face it it's a shithole.
If thats your opinion, why did/do you live there then?
Not true to say that the polcie arent doing anything about it - crack/guns/poverty/prostitution etc arent exactly the kind of thing that can be fixed with a magic truncheon.
Brixton can be grim - last Saturday morning, I saw a crack whore wanking a trampy fellow off in the phone booth opposite the tube station. Which was nice.
pics or stfu :rolleyes:
just to add my tuppence worth. this is an appaling crime carried out by an idiot(s) fuelled, i guess, by drugs or the want of 'respect'.
i think half the problem here is that it has happened right in the heart of brixton inside somewhere where, despite not always being the nicest place to visit, you dont expect shootings at that time of day. this will (and indeed has, judging by the sateillite trucks parked up near ritzy) attract much more attention than a shooting elsewhere in Brixton - even just across the road in CHL.
luckily crimes like this are a rarity even in the 'badlands' of Brixton.
Personally i would like to see this kind of outrage at every shooting that happens in London, not just ones that happen in places the wider public can associate with - maybe then the mindless loss of life can be addressed and not just relegated to a 'nib' in the metro.
Be interesting to see if this fuckwit gets turned in, i hope so.
If thats your opinion, why did/do you live there then?
Not true to say that the polcie arent doing anything about it - crack/guns/poverty/prostitution etc arent exactly the kind of thing that can be fixed with a magic truncheon.
I'm moving. I'm having a kid and I'm off to another part of London which isn't particularly posh, but it's quiet and boring. I want boring - a million times better than the shitty in yer face nightmare that Brixton has become. Plus I don't want the newborn sprog to be exposed to crackheads pissing all over the street, arguing, harrassing me for five pence toward the next rock. Or losers letting off firearms on the High Street.
Ms Ordinary
29-09-2006, 17:07
really I don't recognise this somewhat hysterical picture thats being painted here.
Neither do I - sometimes I read threads like this & wonder if I'm wandering around with my eyes shut because I don't notice these 'bad vibes on the street' or live in fear of 'accidentally making eye contact' with someone.
And I still think its a decent place to bring up kids - not perfect, but everywhere has its problems.
I mean, fine to move out if you want to live in the countryside or whatever, but don't fool yourself that you'll be protecting your children by doing so. (this bit is obviously not directed at Aurora).
RushcroftRoader
29-09-2006, 17:08
One shooting doesn't make Brixton Gangland Central!!!
But times must be tough, saw "got 5p mate?" crackhead begger guy this morning and he was only asking for a penny!!
PacificOcean
29-09-2006, 17:13
How lot can you shrug your shoulders and say, oh well, Brixton isn't that bad?
Someone went into McDonalds and opened fire, at a time when it would have been full of children.
If these "wanna be ganstas" want to shoot themselves to kingdom come in some crack house or back alley, then fair enough, but opening fire in McDonalds when familes are about is unforgivable and a worrying new devlopment too.
As someone who grew up in the area, I'd never thought I see the day when it got this bad and Brixton has never exactly been Henly-on-Thames.
Neither do I - sometimes I read threads like this & wonder if I'm wandering around with my eyes shut because I don't notice these 'bad vibes on the street' or live in fear of 'accidentally making eye contact' with someone.
i think theres a few places where that would apply to - round the usual haunts in the small hours can be fucking grim.
but i have thought that everywhere i have lived tbh.
How lot can you shrug your shoulders and say, oh well, Brixton isn't that bad?
Someone went into McDonalds and opened fire, at a time when it would have been full of children.
If these "wanna be ganstas" want to shoot themselves to kingdom come in some crack house or back alley, then fair enough, but opening fire in McDonalds when familes are about is unforgivable and a worrying new devlopment too.
As someone who grew up in the area, I'd never thought I see the day when it got this bad and Brixton has never exactly been Henly-on-Thames.
i dont think anyone is downplaying how wrong this crime is one bit.
they are just also not saying brixton has become somewhere kurt russell would wear leather and ride a motorbike round wasting people.
Orang Utan
29-09-2006, 17:20
Brixton has several parallel universes that occasionally overlap - yesterday was one of those occasions, but most of the time Brixton residents are blithely unaware of the other worlds
aurora green
29-09-2006, 17:24
How lot can you shrug your shoulders and say, oh well, Brixton isn't that bad?
Someone went into McDonalds and opened fire, at a time when it would have been full of children.
If these "wanna be ganstas" want to shoot themselves to kingdom come in some crack house or back alley, then fair enough, but opening fire in McDonalds when familes are about is unforgivable and a worrying new devlopment too.
As someone who grew up in the area, I'd never thought I see the day when it got this bad and Brixton has never exactly been Henly-on-Thames.
No one is shrugging their shoulders. Everywhere I've gone today with my young son, this terrible incident was being discussed. I think this is a community in shock and horror at what has happened. This in no way is a normal or regular occurance,
I come back to same thing I posted earlier, where on earth are the youngsters getting these guns from? Who is supplying them? How come they fall so easily into the hands of youngsters?
phildwyer
29-09-2006, 17:37
I come back to same thing I posted earlier, where on earth are the youngsters getting these guns from? Who is supplying them?
Most illegal guns originate in Eastern Europe, especially Serbia and Albania.
RushcroftRoader
29-09-2006, 17:40
How lot can you shrug your shoulders and say, oh well, Brixton isn't that bad?
Someone went into McDonalds and opened fire, at a time when it would have been full of children.
If these "wanna be ganstas" want to shoot themselves to kingdom come in some crack house or back alley, then fair enough, but opening fire in McDonalds when familes are about is unforgivable and a worrying new devlopment too.
As someone who grew up in the area, I'd never thought I see the day when it got this bad and Brixton has never exactly been Henly-on-Thames.
People are murdered on their doorsteps in Chelsea, Knightsbridge and Notting Hill as well. Its always shocking when it happens on your doorstep, buts lets just take a measured view here.
The shooting is horrific and shocking because everybody can imagine being in the queue when it happened. It doesn't matter where you live, violence is potentially just yards away.
Brixton is not descending into some sort of gangland hell. We have had two shootings in the space of a week. The first, in all likelihood, involved folk from outside the borough in all probability and the second is, at the moment, an isolated incident.
Anyone who thinks this is a new problem should check out this article (http://observer.guardian.co.uk/focus/story/0,,656125,00.html)from 2002.
Most illegal guns originate in Eastern Europe, especially Serbia and Albania.
its a piece of piss to get guns these days.
dirt cheap too.
phildwyer
29-09-2006, 18:05
its a piece of piss to get guns these days.
dirt cheap too.
Yep. What happened was Eastern European arms factories lost their markets with the collapse of Communism, and they began to sell to criminals instead.
trabuquera
29-09-2006, 18:12
It's interesting the sort of reactions that are coming out here.
When I first heard about this I have to confess my reactions were a) shock, b) horror, c) annoyance and d) a prejudiced guess that this was a random shooting about something unbelievably minor (i.e. 'respect' shooting because of someone getting their foot stepped on or their gaze returned or some such bollocks.)
Then I heard from people who know more that it is very probably directly related to a stabbing a few weeks back (one of the mcD's gunshot victims was the only witness to the previous offence). So it was NOT an entirely random event.
That doesn't make it any more excusable, it doesn't mean it's remotely acceptable to shoot teenagers (even if you're another teenager) and especially not in daylight in a place full of tiny kids. But it bears thinking about in case you are in danger of being swept up in the 'fort apache SW9, it's like south central out there' panic.
Crap like this brings out the law n'order bigot in me I have to confess, so I hope the police find this scumbag and throw the book at him. Preferably a very large very heavy leather-bound legal tome. Incredibly bloody depressing when you think "well, thank god at least it was only a shotgun and not an automatic", because in that site at that hour things could have been oh so much worse.
It's a horrifying event, but it doesn't mean that Brixton is a horrifying place, if that makes sense.
RushcroftRoader
29-09-2006, 18:28
It's a horrifying event, but it doesn't mean that Brixton is a horrifying place, if that makes sense.
Seconded
Yep. What happened was Eastern European arms factories lost their markets with the collapse of Communism, and they began to sell to criminals instead.
thanks for stating the obvious phil :rolleyes:
phildwyer
29-09-2006, 18:49
thanks for stating the obvious phil :rolleyes:
Just following your lead, hombre.
its a piece of piss to get guns these days.
dirt cheap too.
in brixton i dont believe much is very random - which is probably why so many people can get by without ever experiencing anything bad. i think from living here for a while that most things are retaliation or direct response to something else involving the victim.
i like brixton very much and i will be sad to go, i fully expect to come back one day (nobody ever really leaves as such ;)). having just spend the w/e in bristol i have to say that the streets here are spotless in comparison with an army of dilligent and very friendly sweepers working pretty much night and day.
i think there is a problem with teenagers but thats cos the schools are busy, packed and far away. there is a problem with overcrowding because the pavements are too small and that leads to people invading others personal space a bit too much. and there is obviously a problem with scum persistent sometimes agressive dealers.
i guess i get a view inside peoples homes at work and theres a lot fo disfunctional homes but that can be turned round with a bit of incentive and time and effort.
i do worry that brixton fails children though. nto that theres a green and pleasant land just round the corner, but lots of children here have very slack role models and negative inputs.
but its home
:cool:
ViolentPanda
29-09-2006, 19:27
This post seems fairly accurate to me. I've lived around here for 8 years and basically agree that the squalor, begging, crack epidemic and failure by the police to do anything about it have become totally out of control. Let's face it it's a shithole.
Well of course you'd agree with urbanspaceman. About two-thirds of your entire posting history is taken up with your pissing, moaning and whining about how terrible the area is.
Do yourself a favour and move away, eh? That way we won't have to read your angst-ridden whingeing.
ViolentPanda
29-09-2006, 19:29
I'm moving. I'm having a kid and I'm off to another part of London which isn't particularly posh, but it's quiet and boring. I want boring - a million times better than the shitty in yer face nightmare that Brixton has become. Plus I don't want the newborn sprog to be exposed to crackheads pissing all over the street, arguing, harrassing me for five pence toward the next rock. Or losers letting off firearms on the High Street.
Ah, you are moving. Good for you, good for us, but probably a pain in the arse for the area you move too. :)
ViolentPanda
29-09-2006, 19:36
Most illegal guns originate in Eastern Europe, especially Serbia and Albania.
There's been loads of FSU shite flloating around since '91, and there were quite a few handguns floating around when the wall came down too.
I'm just grateful that we've not had people importing fragmentation grenades too.
Well I'm off to Tesco, if you don't hear from me it's prolly cos I've been shot while recieving a handjob from a crack whore.
ViolentPanda
29-09-2006, 19:41
Yep. What happened was Eastern European arms factories lost their markets with the collapse of Communism, and they began to sell to criminals instead.
Bear in mind that like the US military, the Soviets maintained large caches of small arms in just about every region. Many of those caches were looted wholesale post '91, and the contents sold off for a fraction of their value.
ViolentPanda
29-09-2006, 19:43
Well I'm off to Tesco, if you don't hear from me it's prolly cos I've been shot while recieving a handjob from a crack whore.
You wish! :D :D
RaverDrew
29-09-2006, 20:34
You wish! :D :D
<sniggers> :D
It was probably over something REALLY IMPORTANT, like, the victim "dissed" the shooter by pushing in the queue for his Big Mac......
I'm sorry but I think that kind of attitude completely trivialises the whole problem.
I'm completely disgusted and saddened by what's happened, lets hope the two boys who were shot and everybody who witnessed such a horrific incident are okay.
Steady on peeps!
I can't believe I live in the same town as some of you.
I've just been having a major dilemma about leaving here and moving to West Norwood, and although the move might still go ahead, my hearts not really in it...
West Norwood's rough as fuck!
aurora green
29-09-2006, 21:35
West Norwood's rough as fuck!
thanks.
RaverDrew
29-09-2006, 22:23
West Norwood's rough as fuck!
Fuck off :mad:
dull as fuck maybe :o
rough as fuck ? nope, we is all civilized down this way, unless you tread on our toes, or look at us funny ;)
RaverDrew
29-09-2006, 22:23
West Norwood's rough as fuck!
Fuck off :mad:
dull as fuck maybe :o
rough as fuck ? nope, we is all civilized down this way, unless you tread on one of our six toes, or look at us funny ;)
I'm sorry but I think that kind of attitude completely trivialises the whole problem.
I'm completely disgusted and saddened by what's happened, lets hope the two boys who were shot and everybody who witnessed such a horrific incident are okay.
I am not trying to trivialise what happened - rather point out how fucking trivial the reasons for some (many) of these kind of incidents actually are.
Giles..
William of Walworth
30-09-2006, 07:30
dull as fuck maybe :o
rough as fuck ? nope, we is all civilized down this way, unless you tread on our toes, or look at us funny ;)
Drew knows of what he speaks aurora .... Norwood is alright
And if it gets too boring/dull, there's a train and a bus or two to get you to other places:)
RaverDrew
30-09-2006, 09:00
We don't usually take too kind to strangers aurora...
http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/6867/hicknr9.jpg
But for you we'll make an exception, cos you got yourself a mighty purdy name. :cool:
detective-boy
30-09-2006, 09:38
:(
What the fuck was this one all about? 'You calling my burger a batty bwoy?'
Occuptaional hazard of McD's advertising arm insisting on referring to "two all beef patties ..." instead of using proper English, what with urban pronunciation being what it is ... :(
brixtonvilla
30-09-2006, 09:41
Occuptaional hazard of McD's advertising arm insisting on referring to "two all beef patties ..." instead of using proper English, what with urban pronunciation being what it is ... :(
Someone probably asked them if they "got beef".
detective-boy
30-09-2006, 09:50
More info at Black Information Link (http://www.blink.org.uk/pdescription.asp?key=12734&grp=55&cat=199).
And there, in paragraph 2, is exactly why this is a waste of copy ...
Church leaders, community activists and politicians put on a united front to overcome fears of giving evidence to the police.
Until there is a recognised voice of youth talking to youth then it will not hit home - I frequently found young (20s), London born and bred police officers tended to have more impact on young offenders that the majority of church leaders, community activists and politicians. Only youth workers, who often tended to be younger, were, in my experience, more impactive on the group who need to be engaged.
aurora green
30-09-2006, 09:54
We don't usually take too kind to strangers aurora...
...But for you we'll make an exception, cos you got yourself a mighty purdy name. :cool:
Aww...thanks.:D
detective-boy
30-09-2006, 10:00
luckily crimes like this are a rarity even in the 'badlands' of Brixton.
Apparently the "weekly average" this week has been about the same as usual, despite the media hype. It's just that several of the incidents have caught their attention for some reason (e.g. the age of the victims and time / place of the Macdonalds one) and they've gone into one of their periodic moral panics.
That said, Brixton and other areas with large black populations, will statistically be more affected that other areas as there is indisputable evidence that young (under 24) black men are by far the most likely victims of shootings at present (I think I saw 30 times more likely somewhere - probably BBC News in a half asleep daze this morning). They are also the most likely suspects as well.
This is a very significant problem and it has been exercising the black community for some years. Sadly no-one has yet worked out an effective way of undermining the desire to carry guns (this is usually the only considered, deliberate act - pulling it out and then using it tend to be immediate responses to things said or done). Increasing penalties for carrying guns has been tried in stages for some years now and even though we are now talking about significant imprisonment for a first offence, the deterrent value does not yet seem to have kicked in. As with many problems I suspect the answer to the causes are in education / social services / community acivity rather than in policing and criminal justice which tend to focus on the symptoms. Perhaps some input on dealing with conflict for teenagers would help?
detective-boy
30-09-2006, 10:05
.. but opening fire in McDonalds when familes are about is unforgivable and a worrying new devlopment too.
Sadly it's not new (despite what the media would have you believe). I remember dealing with shootings in fast-food restaurants, playgrounds and other venues where there were children about over fifteen years ago. My first major enquiry when I took over a murder squad nearly ten years ago involved thirteen shots being fired at the victim and his vehicle with a street ful of kids playing football behind them (in a cul-de-sac just off Landor Road).
detective-boy
30-09-2006, 10:14
I come back to same thing I posted earlier, where on earth are the youngsters getting these guns from? Who is supplying them? How come they fall so easily into the hands of youngsters?
There are any number of supply routes but (and I regret to say that even I am forced to agree with phildwyer ... Note to Ed: Please check because I think the user name "phildwyer" may have been hacked or cloned or something ...) Eastern Europe is very frequently found to be the root at present - transport from there within the effectively borderless EU is particularly easy.
Significant numbers of weapons are also imported and traded entirely legally as deactivated weapons, then being reactivated by those with the (very limited) skills needed. Banning the trade and possession of deactivated weapons would be the only significant legal / policing change that I can see would have any major effect without having a huge civil liberties downside (most potential policing changes involving in increased stop / search at borders or generally).
The use of firearms by drug dealers has created a market for weapons which has encouraged the traders and re-activators. And the use of increasingly young children as runners by drug dealers has brought teenagers into the world where a few questions will lead to a source and where the money required (which is not massive - just a few hundred quid at most) is readily available from their drug-running activities (and where the dealer they are running for has a vested interest in assisting with the protection of their staff in any event). Those involved in this world (and there may not be massive numbers) also move in other mainstream teenage circles - music, venues, local groupings (a.k.a. "gangs"). Non-criminal members of these circles see a friend with a gun. That person is seen to gain kudos for having one (the impact of rap etc. music comes into play here) and suddenly everyone wants one.
Paulie Tandoori
30-09-2006, 10:16
Apparently the "weekly average" this week has been about the same as usual, despite the media hype. It's just that several of the incidents have caught their attention for some reason (e.g. the age of the victims and time / place of the Macdonalds one) and they've gone into one of their periodic moral panics.
That said, Brixton and other areas with large black populations, will statistically be more affected that other areas as there is indisputable evidence that young (under 24) black men are by far the most likely victims of shootings at present (I think I saw 30 times more likely somewhere - probably BBC News in a half asleep daze this morning). They are also the most likely suspects as well.
This is a very significant problem and it has been exercising the black community for some years. Sadly no-one has yet worked out an effective way of undermining the desire to carry guns (this is usually the only considered, deliberate act - pulling it out and then using it tend to be immediate responses to things said or done). Increasing penalties for carrying guns has been tried in stages for some years now and even though we are now talking about significant imprisonment for a first offence, the deterrent value does not yet seem to have kicked in. As with many problems I suspect the answer to the causes are in education / social services / community acivity rather than in policing and criminal justice which tend to focus on the symptoms. Perhaps some input on dealing with conflict for teenagers would help?
Could also try to control the UK's rampant arms industry (http://www.caat.org.uk/)- if we weren't making so many, they wouldn't be able to get hold of them so easily. Supply and demand, innit.
But i agree with you on the education/SS/parenting aspects. Youth with little meaningful moral guidance, probably scared but acting the big man, cos no-ones ever taught them how to stand up for themselves without feeling the need to harm the person they got a beef with.
edited to add link to CAAT
detective-boy
30-09-2006, 10:22
Could also try to control the UK's rampant arms industry (http://www.caat.org.uk/)- if we weren't making so many, they wouldn't be able to get hold of them so easily. Supply and demand, innit.
Though I have no love for the arms industry, any sort of changes or controls at that level are way, way far too removed from this problem to have any short or medium term impact. There are MILLIONS of guns in the world already. Stopping the production of more will not have any impact on UK street crime for decades.
As with suicide bombers ("the only sure way to stop them is to stop them hating you so much they want to") the only answer is to stop the young people wanting to carry a gun.
I'm sorry but all this stuff about Brixton being some kind of dark and evil place is frankly bollocks...
Anyone remember the shootings outside Turnmills? Don't see people saying 'ah, Farringdon - dodgy as fuck that place' do you? I remember when I was working in Covent garden - down one street you've got Carluccio's, stylish boutiques etc, few seconds away you've got people dealing crack. Back in Tufnell park (where I lived before) a mate of mine was stabbed to within an inch of his life near the tube... Avoiding muggings was a daily matter, even in the early morning/afternoon. And has anyone walked through Camden after all the gigs have finished and the teens have packed off back to wherever they go? Fucking dark place... Grim looking crack heads mouthing off at each other. And before anyone says 'if only we were like continental Europe' you can shut up too... Thinking of the Champs Elysee etc as the face of Paris is like associating London with the area around St Paul's.
Fact is in Brixton I've never felt threatened by the violence - admittedly that's probably because I live on Tulse Hill and never actually have to stray off the main roads but you could say that about so much of London. This incident has been shocking though it must be said...
ChrisFilter
30-09-2006, 11:33
West Norwood's rough as fuck!
Fuck off is it! Sometimes head down there to get bitsand bobs from the High St and it's quiet, peaceful and no sign of trouble.. like Drew said, it's fucking dull, but not rough.
gaijingirl
30-09-2006, 11:55
I spend/have spent quite a bit of time in W. Norwood. IMO it does sometimes give the outer appearance of being rough! However, it's not so bad. In fact some of it seems surprisingly affluent to me. There are a lot of really leafy streets with big old houses (and people who describe their address as Dulwich :D mixed in with the smaller terraces).
There is this little motley crew - 2 women and 1 man with shopping carts - who get on the buses there outside the Woolies very often. I think they must all have mental health problems and they certainly live on the street. Either way - the smell of shit guarantees that everyone else on the bus gets off at the next stop... :eek: :D
I appreciate that some people might choose to live on the street - but surely no one chooses to actually be covered in shit? There's another lady who I speak to very often in Brixton who also has problems. She's lovely, but extremely paranoid and I do wonder if she's getting the help she needs.
Sorry - gone a bit off topic there, but I do wonder how people who are so outwardly in need of help fall through the cracks - so to speak?! Or maybe they just don't want help - I suppose you can't force people to accept a wash and a change of clothes. :confused:
Anyway, all this talk of Brixton being scary and of W. Norwood being rough. I remember that guy who had his head chopped off with an axe in the poshest bit of Belsize Park a few years ago. Then there was the guy murdered on his doorstep in Kensington. My mother, who lives in Bromley said that the number of yellow boards reporting violent crimes there is enormous these days. A lot of it is to do with false perceptions and media stereotying AFAIC.
RushcroftRoader
30-09-2006, 12:41
"I live in a dodgier area than you!"
"NO you don't!"
"Yes I do."
"Fuck off, no you don't"
"I fuckin do".
BLAH BLAH BLAH
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
gaijingirl
30-09-2006, 12:49
Yeah.. but you win hands down on Rushcroft Road... ;) :D
RaverDrew
30-09-2006, 13:31
"I live in a dodgier area than you!"
"NO you don't!"
"Yes I do."
"Fuck off, no you don't"
"I fuckin do".
BLAH BLAH BLAH
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Do get a life :rolleyes:
I don't see anyone on this thread bragging about what a dodgy hell hole they live in just to look cool. Infact I can only see the opposite.
re where guns come from in the UK
people like this who the police busted recently. frightening amount of weapons lurking in suburbia.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/frontpage/story/0,,1872055,00.html
Ah, you are moving. Good for you, good for us, but probably a pain in the arse for the area you move too. :)
I'll be off now. You can go and cuddle a crackkhead. Bye.
You said you were off 6 weeks ago. Get on with it.
linerider
30-09-2006, 15:22
I'll be off now. You can go and cuddle a crackkhead. Bye.
What a tosser.
Gixxer1000
30-09-2006, 15:31
What a tosser.
You going to elaborate? Or are you just another internerd hard man wading in?:rolleyes:
Dubversion
30-09-2006, 15:41
You going to elaborate? Or are you just another internerd hard man wading in?:rolleyes:
what's to elaborate? any cursory glance at goldman's posts will confirm linerider's succinct precis of his character.
And what are you? are YOU Just another internerd hardman wading in?
oh, :rolleyes:
:D
thanks.
Sorry, if you're seriously thinking about moving there that was a bit insensitive, but I look after two kids in W Norwood and their (hardened scouser) dad's in the process of moving because he thinks it's too rough. All I ever bloody hear when I go round there is how bad it and the locals are. No offence Drew :p
The point is it doesn't matter whether you live in a city, the suburbs or the country, you're bound to experience some sort of trouble at some point because sadly, people can be right bastards sometimes. Stay where you and your kids are happy if you can.
Mrs Magpie
30-09-2006, 15:54
Enid, I think it's a council transfer....my experience from moving from one estate to another is that it is toughest for the kids when you've not lived there for very long
linerider
30-09-2006, 16:18
You going to elaborate? Or are you just another internerd hard man wading in?:rolleyes:
So if your too stupid to understand,Goldman slags Brixton off and accuses people who still like living here of sticking up for crackheads.I my view the actions of a tosser.
RushcroftRoader
30-09-2006, 16:33
Yeah.. but you win hands down on Rushcroft Road... ;) :D
Hey, I am at the nice end of Rushcroft!
ViolentPanda
30-09-2006, 17:31
I'll be off now. You can go and cuddle a crackkhead. Bye.
Yep, 'bye. Don't let the door hit your arse as you leave.
ViolentPanda
30-09-2006, 17:32
You said you were off 6 weeks ago. Get on with it.
If that's any indication of how slow he does stuff, he'll still be waiting to move from Brixton when his expected kid isold enough to start secondary school.
ViolentPanda
30-09-2006, 17:36
You going to elaborate? Or are you just another internerd hard man wading in?:rolleyes:
If anyone is an "internerd" I reckon it must be you, ya soapy twat.
Go on, do like I said on the previous page. Have a look at goldman's posting history. 50-odd posts, and two thirds of 'em are him whining about how shitty Brixton is.
Or do you prefer to shout the odds like you're accusing others of doing?
Gixxer1000
30-09-2006, 17:37
So if your too stupid to understand,Goldman slags Brixton off and accuses people who still like living here of sticking up for crackheads.I my view the actions of a tosser.
Nope, reading some of his posts he's pissed off and he's moving, do you think an exodus of people like him ie middle class,will be good for Brixton? I dont.
The fact is its getting to the point where people (black and white) dont feel safe enough to bring up their kids here.
The loss of vocal white middle classes who historically are most sucessfull at lobbying to improve local schools/services will do Brixton no favours.
Gixxer1000
30-09-2006, 17:38
If anyone is an "internerd" I reckon it must be you, ya soapy twat.
Go on, do like I said on the previous page. Have a look at goldman's posting history. 50-odd posts, and two thirds of 'em are him whining about how shitty Brixton is.
Or do you prefer to shout the odds like you're accusing others of doing?
Oh dear post count willy waving.
Soapy twat - like that I'll be using that:D ;)
ViolentPanda
30-09-2006, 17:40
So if your too stupid to understand,Goldman slags Brixton off and accuses people who still like living here of sticking up for crackheads.I my view the actions of a tosser.
Yep. His first post on this thread was " This post seems fairly accurate to me. I've lived around here for 8 years and basically agree that the squalor, begging, crack epidemic and failure by the police to do anything about it have become totally out of control. Let's face it it's a shithole."
One of his first contributions on the site was " Drug dealing scumbags.
If there's ever been a good reason to generally smarten up and dare I say it gentrify certain areas of Brixton, the vile parasites that hang around the corner of Saltoun Road and Windrush square must certainly be it. These sorry vermin crawl 0out at night and sell crack to junkies, and the cops do nothiong about it. Last night some pathetic junkie was sitting on my doorstep at 4 am getting high on my property. My girlfriend had to ask him to get ou the way so she could get through the front door. What a complete waste of space. This hopeless specimen actually asked her if he had to move. Well yes he did. And the cops should bust the wankers who sell him the stuff at the end of the road. If this is what keeping it real in Brixton is all about, then the sooner some developer that decrepit old shooting gallery by the square into luxury flats the better. The cops are cowards, the dealers the worst kind of lowlife and the junkies are sub-human."
There's a bit of a theme running through his bilious ramblings, don't you think? :) ;)
ViolentPanda
30-09-2006, 17:43
Oh dear post count willy waving.
Where?
I mentioned goldman's posting history, nothing about "post counts", you terminally-dim blob of pondlife.
Soapy twat - like that I'll be using that:D ;)
It'd make a good tagline for your username, kind of warn people not to expect anything approaching rational thought from you.
Gixxer1000
30-09-2006, 17:47
Where?
I mentioned goldman's posting history, nothing about "post counts", you terminally-dim blob of pondlife.
It'd make a good tagline for your username, kind of warn people not to expect anything approaching rational thought from you.
Calm down dear.
ViolentPanda
30-09-2006, 17:51
Nope, reading some of his posts he's pissed off and he's moving, do you think an exodus of people like him ie middle class,will be good for Brixton? I dont.
Yes, but his attitude (highlighted by his lovely turns of phrase when describing just about anyone he doesn't approve of in Brixton) is such that he's hardly likely to approach dealing with any "local problems" he has in a rational manner, is he?
The fact is its getting to the point where people (black and white) dont feel safe enough to bring up their kids here.
But that's pretty much the same in any British inner city, in fact I'd rather live in Brixton than plenty of other inner cities.
It doesn't help that we have shit thrown at the area by the media either.
Did you see the headline for friday's Standard? "The HItman at MacDonalds" ffs! :mad:
Now call me old-fashioned, but I thought that to call someone a hitman, they had to have been hired to kill someone, and I didn't notice the sub-Standard producing any evidence of that.
The loss of vocal white middle classes who historically are most sucessfull at lobbying to improve local schools/services will do Brixton no favours.
That's arse about face. The "vocal white middle classes" who have tended to educate their children outside the borough weren't doing Brixton any favours anyway.
Gixxer1000
30-09-2006, 18:14
Yes, but his attitude (highlighted by his lovely turns of phrase when describing just about anyone he doesn't approve of in Brixton) is such that he's hardly likely to approach dealing with any "local problems" he has in a rational manner, is he?.
Rational manner? Internets funny like that isnt it? Wont quote your previous post.
But that's pretty much the same in any British inner city. That s ok then
It doesn't help that we have shit thrown at the area by the media either.
Did you see the headline for friday's Standard? "The HItman at MacDonalds" ffs! :mad:. Agreed, didnt even make the nationals AFAIK though.
That's arse about face. The "vocal white middle classes" who have tended to educate their children outside the borough weren't doing Brixton any favours anyway.
Not for primary education they dont, unless they cant get their kids in to some of the excellent local schools, cant very well send them to a local secondary though can they?
linerider
30-09-2006, 18:45
Yep. His first post on this thread was " This post seems fairly accurate to me. I've lived around here for 8 years and basically agree that the squalor, begging, crack epidemic and failure by the police to do anything about it have become totally out of control. Let's face it it's a shithole."
"The cops are cowards, the dealers the worst kind of lowlife and the junkies are sub-human."
There's a bit of a theme running through his bilious ramblings, don't you think? :) ;)
I think these are the words of a tosser
:(
Nope, reading some of his posts he's pissed off and he's moving, do you think an exodus of people like him ie middle class,will be good for Brixton? I dont.
The fact is its getting to the point where people (black and white) dont feel safe enough to bring up their kids here.
The loss of vocal white middle classes who historically are most sucessfull at lobbying to improve local schools/services will do Brixton no favours.
Aha. All middle class people are selfish whiney tossers are they? Hmmmmm.
Oh dear post count willy waving.
Eh? :confused: :confused:
suzee blue cheese
30-09-2006, 19:10
Another thread bites the dust :rolleyes:
kidtripod
30-09-2006, 19:20
There is an important point, that you could end up with all the good people leaving, however I think the concern shown in this thread, and "out there" demonstrates people do actually care about the area, and would rather stay and help it improve than simply jump ship. To be honest it's that which is one of the reasons I ended up moving here in the first place - it has it's faults, but people do choose to live here and make a life here, not simply pass through as with so much of london.
I'd be depressed if the reaction was that this is all normal. But it isn't.
phildwyer
30-09-2006, 19:22
cant very well send them to a local secondary though can they?
Why on earth not?
Gixxer1000
30-09-2006, 19:26
Why on earth not?
Because there isnt one in brixton:rolleyes:
readonly
30-09-2006, 20:53
I always knew McDonalds was bad for you.......:D
ViolentPanda
30-09-2006, 21:16
Rational manner? Internets funny like that isnt it? Wont quote your previous post.
Rather like you can't really quote your own, eh?
That s ok then
No it isn't. It's far from okay.
But trying to imply that Brixton is singularly bad is also far from okay.
Agreed, didnt even make the nationals AFAIK though.
Not the front pages, anyway.
Not for primary education they dont, unless they cant get their kids in to some of the excellent local schools, cant very well send them to a local secondary though can they?
That's the point though.
Why do you think that several secondary schools got closed down in the 1990s, after all, if not for a combination of demographic change in the amount of children in the borough combined with people sending their children further afield?
ViolentPanda
30-09-2006, 21:17
I think these are the words of a tosser
:(
Exactly.
It's not like most people in this forum don't acknowledge that Brixton has problems, some of them pretty damn bad, but goldman can't seem to find a single redeeming feature for the area.
linerider
30-09-2006, 21:28
Exactly.
It's not like most people in this forum don't acknowledge that Brixton has problems, some of them pretty damn bad, but goldman can't seem to find a single redeeming feature for the area.
Someone who calls junkies subhuman is beyond contempt.I'm an ex junkie,therefore I used to be subhuman.
bloody hell why do so many threads in brixton forum involve arguing???!!!!!:( :rolleyes:
and yes i did just say bloody hell :o :D
linerider
01-10-2006, 00:32
bloody hell why do so many threads in brixton forum involve arguing???!!!!!:( :rolleyes:
and yes i did just say bloody hell :o :D
No they don't
:rolleyes: