View Full Version : Local Elections in Lambeth
citydreams
14-01-2006, 12:04
Sure there are dishonest men in local government. But there are dishonest men in national government too.
Is it too early in the year for a pessimisits versus optimists debate on the upcoming local elections?
Will Shane finally be crowned king of Brixton?
Will it make any difference to the way Lambeth is run?
If this thread goes well I'd be keen to see if we can get an online hustings going at the Ed's bequest.
Ladies and Gentlemen, let's be having you.
memespring
14-01-2006, 12:34
Is it too early in the year for a pessimisits versus optimists debate on the upcoming local elections?
Will Shane finally be crowned king of Brixton?
Will it make any difference to the way Lambeth is run?
If this thread goes well I'd be keen to see if we can get an online hustings going at the Ed's bequest.
Ladies and Gentlemen, let's be having you.
Online hustings are a great idea. All the candidates should blog their policies/campaigns too.
Personally I'll vote for whoever (within reason obviously) does the most to try and engage their electorate.
aurora green
14-01-2006, 14:14
Let's hope that disgusting scumbag Fitchett, gets booted out.
Tricky Skills
14-01-2006, 14:34
Not to mention the Stockwell Whitewashers (http://www.mondaysmusings.blogspot.com/pictemps/knobber_bott.html) - prize knobbers.
Vauxhall Lib Dems (http://www.vauxhall.libdems.org.uk/)
Lambeth Labour (http://www.lambethlabour.com/)
Lambeth Conservatives (http://www.conservatives.lambeth.com/)
memespring
16-01-2006, 13:09
Does anyone know when/where the candidate lists are published?
lang rabbie
16-01-2006, 13:50
Does anyone know when/where the candidate lists are published?
Although the "Notice of Poll" listing the candidates doesn't have to be published until 25th April, Lambeth's elections team will probably publish the official lists very shortly after the deadline for withdrawal of nominations on Thursday 6th April.
Obviously the established parties have selected most of their "prospective" candidates by now, Expect to see campaigning in some wards from the "Notice of Election" at the end of March.
Official timetable on Electoral Commission website (http://www.electoralcommission.gov.uk/elections/electiontimetable.cfm)
William of Walworth
16-01-2006, 14:41
I'd be very surprised if Shane gets elected, unfortunately. He starts from a long way behind (doesn't he??), even after several campaigns, and despite being known locally, I don't see him doing it ... sorry!.
Will Shane finally be crowned king of Brixton?
No.
Will it make any difference to the way Lambeth is run?
No.
Ladies and Gentlemen, let's be having you.
Never mind though, consol yourself with the thought that the revolution will continue to be zealously debated and prepared here which will no doubt frighten the shite out of this wicked fascist gubment.
citydreams
16-01-2006, 14:52
@Fanta:
So you have effectively decided that one man is as bad as the next? Is that just Lambeth or have you decided that any and all local government is impossible?
memespring
16-01-2006, 14:53
Does anyone know if all the parties publish local manifestos and when they are published?
William of Walworth
16-01-2006, 14:58
Never mind though, consol yourself with the thought that the revolution will continue to be zealously debated and prepared here which will no doubt frighten the shite out of this wicked fascist gubment.
Do you enjoy sneering contemptuously and being generally unpleasant? :rolleyes:
@Fanta:
So you have effectively decided that one man is as bad as the next? Is that just Lambeth or have you decided that any and all local government is impossible?
No.
I've actually voted Shane/Green in the past, but let us be realistic, he is not going to be elected, is he?
citydreams
16-01-2006, 15:00
I've actually voted Shane/Green in the past, but let us be realistic, he is not going to be elected, is he?
Why the question mark then? :D
William of Walworth
16-01-2006, 15:01
My point too -- but I made it without sarcasm ....
Do you enjoy sneering contemptuously and being generally unpleasant? :rolleyes:
Go away quickly William your humourless pomposity is most tiresome. :mad:
citydreams
16-01-2006, 15:13
Fanta, can you please keep your sniping to a firing range? thanks.
Fanta, can you please keep your sniping to a firing range? thanks.
Sorry. :( But it was William who started it by being horrid.
He is always having a go at me. The Bully.
William of Walworth
16-01-2006, 15:45
Go away quickly William your humourless pomposity is most tiresome. :mad:
YOUR description of my posts. A view shared only by one particular Urbanite ;) I think you'll find, which says plenty. Anyway, I suspect my posts are less tiresome to most Urbanites, than your habit of sneering contemptuously (as above).
Sorry. :( But it was William who started it by being horrid.
He is always having a go at me. The Bully.
:rolleyes:
I was responding to YOUR post, which is still there for all to see. You obfuscation deceives no-one I suspect ...
It's not even as if I disagree with you about Shane's (thin) chances, but you couldn't resist a snidey dig not only at citydreams, but more generally ...
On topic :
Can anyone with more Lambeth knowledge than I've got, tell me what the chances are of Fitchett being booted out in his ward?
lang rabbie
16-01-2006, 16:03
No.
I've actually voted Shane/Green in the past, but let us be realistic, he is not going to be elected, is he?
Depends which ward he stands in. Four years ago, in Herne Hill ward Tim Summers got 609 votes for the Greens - only 289 votes behind what Labour's Peter O'Connell needed to get elected.
Town Hall gossip has it that Jackie Meldrum is moving from Tulse Hill ward to contest a leafy but marginal ward in West Norwood, and Tom Franklin is standing down. This suggests to me that Labour think they can three people re-elected in Tulse Hill with minimal effort.
A Green challenge could change that, particularly if Greg Tucker isn't standing this time for whatever Socialist Alliance has transmogrified into by now.
Does anyone know if all the parties publish local manifestos and when they are published?
They do but it's entirely at their discretion how / when they publish. I know the Lib Dems are doing one.
memespring
30-01-2006, 20:57
God, you can tell there is an election comming - bring out the crazy stories:
Apparently Ian Huntley is going to be choosing the next council (http://icsouthlondon.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0400lambeth/tm_objectid=16631968%26method=full%26siteid=50100%26headline=mp%2dslams%2dtown%2dhall%2dover%2dcrime-name_page.html) and Keith Fitchett is getting a body guard (http://icsouthlondon.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0200southlondonheadlines/tm_objectid=16631969%26method=full%26siteid=50100%26headline=%2dheavies%2d%2dhired%2dto%2dprotect%2dcouncillors-name_page.html) .
:rolleyes:
Depends which ward he stands in. Four years ago, in Herne Hill ward Tim Summers got 609 votes for the Greens - only 289 votes behind what Labour's Peter O'Connell needed to get elected.
Town Hall gossip has it that Jackie Meldrum is moving from Tulse Hill ward to contest a leafy but marginal ward in West Norwood, and Tom Franklin is standing down. This suggests to me that Labour think they can three people re-elected in Tulse Hill with minimal effort.
A Green challenge could change that, particularly if Greg Tucker isn't standing this time for whatever Socialist Alliance has transmogrified into by now.
I've heard a whisper that Shane Collins is standing in Herne Hill. I think, given his profile, he'd be in with a chance depending where Green voters put their other two votes. Who knows, given the febrile state of politics locally and nationally, he might even end up with the balance of power :D
Here's the full ward-by-ward 2002 results for Lambeth: http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/A44E07B9-382D-4F15-ABEC-D2B3B4D85472/0/election_results2002.pdf
(nb .pdf document)
Here's the full ward-by-ward 2002 results for Lambeth: http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/A44E07B9-382D-4F15-ABEC-D2B3B4D85472/0/election_results2002.pdf
(nb .pdf document)
I have a copy of that copied into Excel, if anyone wants it.
memespring
31-01-2006, 13:17
Does anyone has previous copies of either local or national manifestos?
memespring
26-03-2006, 21:29
Does anyone know what parties, outside the main four, are standing in the local elections?
I am looking to get a copy of their manifestos and a list of candidates if possiable.
lang rabbie
26-03-2006, 23:16
Blimey, memespring, you're being a bit previous aren't you -the notice of poll only went out on Friday. ;) The only rumour I'd heard were that a couple of anti-stock transfer types from the Clapham Park estate were hoping to stand as Tories :eek: :confused:
Notice of election - London Borough of Lambeth
24 March 2006
Election of Councillors for the Bishop's, Brixton Hill, Coldharbour, Clapham Common, Clapham Town, Ferndale, Gipsy Hill, Herne Hill, Knight's Hill, Larkhall, Oval, Prince's, St. Leonard's, Stockwell, Streatham Hill, Streatham South, Streatham Wells, Thornton, Thurlow Park, Tulse Hill and Vassall Wards of the Borough.
There is to be an Election of the whole Council and THREE councillors are to be elected in each of the above Wards.
Nomination papers must be delivered to Room 26, Lambeth Town Hall, Brixton Hill, SW2 1RW, on any weekday (this does not include Saturday, Sunday or Bank Holidays) after the date of this notice, between the hours of 10.00AM and 4.30PM but not later than noon on the 3rd day of April, 2006.
Nomination papers may be obtained from the Deputy Returning Officer, Room 26, Lambeth Town Hall, Brixton Hill, SW2 1RW, who will give advice if asked, on the completion of a nomination paper.
If the election is contested, the poll will take place on THURSDAY the 4th day of MAY, 2006 from 7.00AM to 10.00PM .
The deadline for receipt of NEW POSTAL VOTE applications and to change OR cancel existing postal or proxy votes is 5.00PM on TUESDAY 18th APRIL, 2006.
The deadline for the return of completed NEW Proxy application forms is 5.00PM on TUESDAY the 25th APRIL, 2006 except for medical emergencies.
The deadline for new proxy applications on the grounds of MEDICAL EMERGENCY is 5.00pm on 4 MAY, 2006
All completed forms should be returned to the Electoral Services Office, Room 26, Lambeth Town Hall, Brixton Hill, London SW2 1RW by the appropriate deadlines.
24TH MARCH, 2006
L.G. LEWIS
DEPUTY RETURNING OFFICER
William of Walworth
27-03-2006, 15:47
The only rumour I'd heard were that a couple of anti-stock transfer types from the Clapham Park estate were hoping to stand as Tories :eek: :confused:
Only in Lambeth ..... nutters. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
memespring
27-03-2006, 20:48
Blimey, memespring, you're being a bit previous aren't you -the notice of poll only went out on Friday. ;)
Plotting ain't I ;)
lang rabbie
29-03-2006, 18:02
From Tuesday's SLP
Mums fight election on school crisis Mar 28 2006
By Education Reporter Zara Bishop
MUMS who campaigned for more secondary school places in a borough where there is a chronic shortage are to stand for election.
Seven will be fighting for seats in the wards represented by the members of Lambeth council's executive - including Prince's ward, where the former executive member for housing who resigned in February is a councillor.
The candidates, who will be representing the Local Education Action by Parents (LEAP) party, launched their election campaign for the local government elections in May outside Lambeth Town Hall in Brixton on Friday.
Mum-of-three and lawyer Dorcas Rogers, 46, who is standing in Streatham Hill ward against Councillor Ashley Lumsden, the council's executive member for finance, said: "We are not career politicians.
"We don't have other agendas. We just want to get school places for kids who don't have anywhere to go at the moment."
On March 1, 375 children in Lambeth were not offered a secondary school place - last year, 561 11-year-olds were in the same situation.
Council figures show that in January 2005, 51 per cent of secondary school pupils travelled outside Lambeth to be educated or attended private or independent schools.
Last July, the council rejected a proposal to build a secondary school on a site off Brixton Hill in favour of expanding existing secondaries across the borough.
There are also plans for an academy in Shakespeare Road, Herne Hill and a secondary school in Elmcourt Road, West Norwood.
Charity worker and mum-of-two Chris Holt, 40, will be up against the leader of the council, Lib Dem councillor Peter Truesdale, in Bishop's ward.
She said: "I think we can win seats. Peter Truesdale only got 1,123 votes in the last election and he wields a lot of power."
Secretary Stela Gildea, 42, will be fighting for a seat in Thurlow Park ward against the deputy leader of the council, Tory councillor John Whelan and his wife, the executive member for the environment, Cllr Clare Whelan.
"The mum-of-four said: "We have got a great chance here. Even if we don't get in we have brought education to the top of the agenda."
Cllr Whelan said: "They are challenging me in my ward where we are actually building a secondary school [Elmgreen School in Elmcourt Road, West Norwood]. It's a bit like bringing coals to Newcastle"
Cllr Truesdale said schools in the borough were improving.
"That is why our schools are so popular," he said. "The administration is expanding existing successful schools in all parts of the borough."
If that is a complete quote from Cllr Whelan, then it's just a tad ungracious? You think he'd welcome their entering the democratic fray and look forward to debating the issues with them.
The implication is that the schools campaigners have the whole of the borough as their concern, whereas Cllr Whelan is just concerned about his ward.
Will Shane finally be crowned king of Brixton?He's actually standing in Herne Hill ward this year, not that there is any one "Brixton" ward - Ferndale, Coldharbour, Tulse Hill and Brixton Hill being the four 'central' wards: also the only Lambeth wards (except Streatham Wells) - iirc - that don't ajoin another borough.
Vauxhall Lib Dems (http://www.vauxhall.libdems.org.uk/)
Lambeth Labour (http://www.lambethlabour.com/)
Lambeth Conservatives (http://www.conservatives.lambeth.com/) :eek:
http://lambeth.greenparty.org.uk/
http://lambeth.greenparty.org.uk/images/frontpage3.jpg
Join our email list for regular updates from the Greens: lambethgreens@postmaster.co.uk
I'd be very surprised if Shane gets elected, unfortunately. He starts from a long way behind (doesn't he??), even after several campaigns, and despite being known locally, I don't see him doing it ... sorry!.Not at all. He is standing in Herne Hill where last time the Greens were not many votes behind Labour. Last time there was not much canvassing and leafletting in Herne Hill, unlike this year, plus the political climate is more unfavourable to Labour than in 2002. There is a *very* good chance that Herne Hill will elect 3 Green councillors.
HERNE HILL (turnout = 6436)
1164 Labour
1160 Labour
898 Labour
609 Green
511 Liberal Democrat
486 Liberal Democrat
415 Conservative
407 Conservative
397 Conservative
389 Liberal Democrat
No.
I've actually voted Shane/Green in the past, but let us be realistic, he is not going to be elected, is he?
Realistically speaking: yes, he has a *very* good chance of being elected, along with the other two Green candidates in Herne Hill, one of whom is interestingly an ex-policewoman!
Realistically speaking: yes, he has a *very* good chance of being elected, along with the other two Green candidates in Herne Hill, one of whom is interestingly an ex-policewoman!
It's interesting that the Greens are putting forward three Green candidates this time in Herne Hill instead of the usual one. Does anyone know the thinking behind this decision? The candidates are obviously working it harder this time and presumably it's based on the view that Shane would be the first choice Green for most people who split their vote whilst a full slate would soak up more of Labour's 'soft' Labour support?
It's interesting that the Greens are putting forward three Green candidates this time in Herne Hill instead of the usual one. Does anyone know the thinking behind this decision? The candidates are obviously working it harder this time and presumably it's based on the view that Shane would be the first choice Green for most people who split their vote whilst a full slate would soak up more of Labour's 'soft' Labour support?The thinking is not that complex...
...in an ideal world the Green party would stand a full slate of candidates in every ward - contesting every single seat that is up for election on the coucil.
However, if there are not enough people to cover all of the seats then you just put up a full slate in "target seats": wards where you have had the best results in the past and where focussing on leafletting, canvassing and campaigning will get the best results in terms of winning seats. Also, having more candidates in a ward means that you have, by extension, more people involved in campaigning (people will tend to get their own friends and relatives to help out - while other local members will be doing stuff in their own wards).
Its worth pointing out that although Shane is well known on u75, all three candidates in Herne Hill are very competant candidates in their own right and are involved with various local commuity groups and issues and that IMO the Green vote holds up well due to Green Party policies not just any "personal" factor.
memespring
02-04-2006, 19:01
I've been helping build an website for Lambeth that will let people add their comments to the parties local manifestos (along the lines of theywanttobeelected.com (http://www.theywanttobeelected.com) ) , find out about who is standing in their ward and generally try and connect candidates with the policies they are standing on.
It needs a name though and I'm out of ideas - lambethelections.org and lambethhustings.com are the best ideas so far. :confused: Any ideas?
ps anyone with any webby knowlage or a bit of time to help organise things please PM me.
citydreams
02-04-2006, 19:30
yourvote.lambeth.org
local.issues.lambeth.org
AnnO'Neemus
03-04-2006, 01:25
Manchester got its first Green councillor a couple of years ago.
Now that people have seen it's possible, hopefully this year there'll be a second in the same ward, maybe more across the city.
memespring
03-04-2006, 10:19
lambethcriminals.org
Might get in trouble for that one ;)
Donatus Anyanwu - Labour
Elkin Atwell - Green
Simon Barry - Conservative
Robert Blackie - Lib Dem
Marcus Booth - Conservative
Geoffrey Bowring - Lib Dem
Rachel Braverman - Green
Rachel Heywood - Labour
Sandra Lawman - Lib Dem
Sharon Malley - Labour
Smarajit Roy - Conservative
Timothy Summers - Green
Political trivia - Smarajit Roy and his seconder Kelly Ben Maimon have both been members of all three political parties in Lambeth in the last few years.
lang rabbie
06-04-2006, 09:08
You can see the lists of candidates nominated for each ward on this page of the Lambeth website:
Election Nominations May 06 (http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/Services/CouncilDemocracy/DemocracyElections/ElectionNominationsMay06.htm)
Donna Ferentes
06-04-2006, 09:13
I saw a Lib Dem leaflet just before I left last month. It was one of the most incoherent leaflets I have ever had the displeasure to read.
It's interesting that the Greens are putting forward three Green candidates this time in Herne Hill instead of the usual one. Does anyone know the thinking behind this decision? The candidates are obviously working it harder this time and presumably it's based on the view that Shane would be the first choice Green for most people who split their vote whilst a full slate would soak up more of Labour's 'soft' Labour support?
(speaking from outside the aera)
I'm surprised they are running three-you'd think they want to keep all the split votes in one place. Purely looking at the result from last time, they look like they could finish third (and hence get elected)if they did so. But I know nothing about local factors.
(speaking from outside the aera)
I'm surprised they are running three-you'd think they want to keep all the split votes in one place. Purely looking at the result from last time, they look like they could finish third (and hence get elected)if they did so. But I know nothing about local factors.
Erm, everyone gets 3 votes since there are 3 councillors up for election. There's no question of diluting their vote.
Donatus Anyanwu - Labour
Elkin Atwell - Green
Simon Barry - Conservative
Robert Blackie - Lib Dem
Marcus Booth - Conservative
Geoffrey Bowring - Lib Dem
Rachel Braverman - Green
Rachel Heywood - Labour
Sandra Lawman - Lib Dem
Sharon Malley - Labour
Smarajit Roy - Conservative
Timothy Summers - Green
Political trivia - Smarajit Roy and his seconder Kelly Ben Maimon have both been members of all three political parties in Lambeth in the last few years.
Thanks for that Bob
Well despite looking at looking at the Labour party manifesto (see Bobs post-number 5 on this thread) I still think the Labour Councillors in Coldharbour Ward have been OK-at least with me :) .
Coldharbour ward is new due to boundary changes.So there were two new Councillors-The Sharons :) (Malley and Eardman).Eardman is standing down due to having just had a baby.Donatus is a long standing Labour Councillor who I think was in Angell ward before the boundary changes.Hes OK but he works on the North end of CH ward.
Both the Sharons were very helpful to me(and he who is banned forever to another site far away ;) ) during the long saga of Larry and the Bike shop.They have also been supportive in other matters connected to housing where I sometimes represent other Brixtonites.They were both new to being Councillors and have IMO done a good job and shown intelligence and committment to there role.
Sharon Malley was also very suppoertive towards the Effra road group over Brixton Central Sq.
Sharon Eardman is being replaced by Rachel Heywood.No comment :rolleyes: Pity shes going.
It really helped having new Councillors without any baggage of being in previous administrations.They were also young for Councillors.Which perhaps helped.
Still the Lambeth Labour manifesto is appaling.Except for opposing the sale of pools(Though I couldnt see explicit opposure of closure of Brixton Rec).The manifesto is full of pics of Charles Clarke and Miliband(reach for the sick bag :p )going on about more ASBOS etc and "Respect".
MatthewCuffe
16-04-2006, 20:25
To what extent do people here think that an anti-New Labour or anti-Blair or anti-war vote will trickle down to Lambeth?
http://www.strategicvoter.org.uk/doku.php
Go SHANE!!!
lang rabbie
17-04-2006, 19:15
A friend in Dulwich Road has just shown me the Green leaflet for Herne Hill.
Oh dear - if there was ever a document that needed sexing up it is this one. :D
The lead story is about energy conservation on the Clapham Park Estate - with a photo of somone who isn't even one of the Herne Hill candidates. :rolleyes:
Thanks for that Bob
Well despite looking at looking at the Labour party manifesto (see Bobs post-number 5 on this thread) I still think the Labour Councillors in Coldharbour Ward have been OK-at least with me :) .
Coldharbour ward is new due to boundary changes.So there were two new Councillors-The Sharons :) (Malley and Eardman).Eardman is standing down due to having just had a baby.Donatus is a long standing Labour Councillor who I think was in Angell ward before the boundary changes.Hes OK but he works on the North end of CH ward.
Both the Sharons were very helpful to me(and he who is banned forever to another site far away ;) ) during the long saga of Larry and the Bike shop.They have also been supportive in other matters connected to housing where I sometimes represent other Brixtonites.They were both new to being Councillors and have IMO done a good job and shown intelligence and committment to there role.
Sharon Malley was also very suppoertive towards the Effra road group over Brixton Central Sq.
Sharon Eardman is being replaced by Rachel Heywood.No comment :rolleyes: Pity shes going.
Just to say two things about them:
1. If I wasn't a political geek I wouldn't know they existed at all - not one piece of paper through my door from them in 18 months of living in the ward - or indeed any other bit of communication except for a reply to an email.
2. During the Brighton Terrace drug centre debate I wasn't impressed that two of them didn't reply to my emails at all, and the third one (I think Sharon Malley) didn't reply to my follow up to her standard reply.
3. They've not shown much interest as far as I can see in the bread & butter things councillors should do like sorting out streetlights. There were none under the Gresham road railway bridge for months (years?) by a bustop - took me a few minutes with an email to sort it out - but more to the point it's the sort of thing they should be sorting out.
Beyond those things though I've got no great gripes against them.
citydreams
18-04-2006, 10:54
link to online manifesto hustings (http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=157521)
:)
Mrs Magpie
18-04-2006, 11:28
A friend in Dulwich Road has just shown me the Green leaflet for Herne Hill.
Oh dear - if there was ever a document that needed sexing up it is this one. :D
The Coldharbour Ward one was pretty good...to be honest I wish they wouldn't harp on about cannabis....I think it loses them more votes than they gain...
corporate whore
18-04-2006, 13:28
I had a word with the Greens canvassing on Lordship Lane yesterday - Herne Hill is their key target Lambeth ward, apparently, hence why Shane Collins is standing there.
Haven't seen their leaflet yet, but should imagine funds are a bit stretched.
memespring
24-04-2006, 10:28
Not sure I think much of Lambeths stratagy to get people to vote: http://www.electionalarmclock.com/elejumper
<what we really need is a flying elephant, that'll get people out>
Not sure I think much of Lambeths stratagy to get people to vote: http://www.electionalarmclock.com/elejumper
<what we really need is a flying elephant, that'll get people out>
Quite bizarre. It is a pilot being run by the electoral commission. I'm personally very sceptical about public sector advertising reminding people to vote but it was free for the council to participate and I didn't think it could do any harm. Next time I'll just have to check about their plans for elephants.
I'm most impressed that someone found it!
One of the best ways of getting more people to vote would be to prevent the electoral roll being used by credit agencies and the like. There are people who are rightly suspicious that being on the electoral roll will mean more debt-collectors arriving and also because they are sub-letting or have some kind of housing arrfangements that might prejudice benefits claims, the rent they are paying and so forth. Some landlords will tell people to not remove their name from the property because they want to keep the address as their main residency and still collect post from there.
The other big factor that would make more people vote was if local politics had more colourful personalities, if local councils had more powers, if people felt that councils didn't just pay lip service to consulting them and then go ahead and do what they intended in the first place, if the workings of the council were more transparent and made available in language that normal people could understand, if specific councillors took personal responsibilty for specific policie and decisions and were made to answer questions in public over them rather than being able to hide away in closed committee meetings in the depths of the town hall, and most importantly - if there were any actual examples of electing a councillor and it making an actual, direct and immediate difference to what happens in the local area. Part of this is the way events are covered in the media and the level of comment and analysis easily avaliable to the public.
lang rabbie
24-04-2006, 16:55
The other big factor that would make more people vote was if local politics had more colourful personalities, if local councils had more powers, if people felt that councils didn't just pay lip service to consulting them and then go ahead and do what they intended in the first place, if the workings of the council were more transparent and made available in language that normal people could understand, if specific councillors took personal responsibilty for specific policie and decisions and were made to answer questions in public over them rather than being able to hide away in closed committee meetings in the depths of the town hall, and most importantly - if there were any actual examples of electing a councillor and it making an actual, direct and immediate difference to what happens in the local area. Part of this is the way events are covered in the media and the level of comment and analysis easily avaliable to the public.
So cynical, for one so young...
If you prefer your Lambeth personalities "colourful", shouldn't you be going around Kennington with "Save the Fitchett" leaflets ;)
And what are these "closed committee meetings in the depths of the town hall" of which you speak? :eek: [goes to look for tinfoil hat]
memespring
24-04-2006, 17:03
So cynical, for one so young...
If you prefer your Lambeth personalities "colourful", shouldn't you be going around Kennington with "Save the Fitchett" leaflets ;)
And what are these "closed committee meetings in the depths of the town hall" of which you speak? :eek: [goes to look for tinfoil hat]
I think the executive meetings are closed (http://www.electionmemory.com/?p=715#comment-59) or something.
lang rabbie
24-04-2006, 17:28
I think the executive meetings are closed (http://www.electionmemory.com/?p=715#comment-59) or something.
Aha! I think that post on your site refers to the "executive" of the little understood and not very democratic Lambeth First (http://www.lambethfirst.org.uk/) - the borough's Local Strategic Partnership - rather than the Executive of Lambeth Council. :confused:
The Lambeth First Executive is the decision-making organ of the partnership with some 20 members who meet monthly*.
The Lambeth First Executive is also responsible includes managing the Partnership’s operational business, taking forward recommendations from the Assembly on Community Strategy development and Neighbourhood Renewal Strategy. It monitors delivery by the Theme Partnerships, has responsibility for the implementation of equalities issues across the partnership, ensures effective communications takes place and also makes recommendations to the Assembly on changes to the Governance documents.
* The Lambeth First Executive meetings are open to the public for the first half hour only. Member(s) of the public will need to contact the Lambeth First Office prior to attending the meeting.
memespring
24-04-2006, 17:46
Aha! I think that post on your site refers to the "executive" of the little understood and not very democratic Lambeth First (http://www.lambethfirst.org.uk/) - the borough's Local Strategic Partnership - rather than the Executive of Lambeth Council. :confused:
That makes sense. After reading their about page though they are still little understood for me. :confused:
And what are these "closed committee meetings in the depths of the town hall" of which you speak? :eek: [goes to look for tinfoil hat]I have managed to get into meetings before but had to leave (or stand outside) for closed sessions. I have also noted that a hell of a lot of decisions are made behind the scenes and before meetings have even happened and the meeting is just to go through the motions and deliver the inevitable.
OK this is true of a lot of politics, but it also means that a lot of decisions are made by small cliques within the main political parties in consultation with anonymous "officers" (who don't talk to the public) and when businesses or other large outside bodies with vast amounts of cash meet up with the council.
The counsil's version of "consultation" is to say "here's what we are proposing and why it is a good idea, have you got any comments". They then collect all these comments and thrown them in the bin and carry on with whatever they have decided.
I also know that if you do wnat to get something done the best way is to cultivate specific contacts both councillors and within directorates, to have a large lobby group with money behind it, and to pouyll as many string s as possible. Only the naive fool seeks to go through official public channels or try and put points across at public meetinmgs or through consultations. While this is fine if you are the type of person who has the contacts, knowledge, time, money and personal skills to do this, the bulk of the ordinary citizenry of Lambeth haven't got a chance in comparison - unless they are fortunate enough to happen to have on of the more consciencious, independent-minded and hard-working and talented councillors who takes up their cause.
I don't suppose you can show me any counter examples to this? Of course I'd love to hear that things have changed massively over the last few years since I was far more involved, but from what I hear nothing has changed.
Furthermore ... just as an experiment I went to the Lambeth website to have a look at the next exective meeting.
Events Diary: here (http://213.130.50.58/clients/lbl/cediary/cgi-bin/cediaryeve.exe?EventsDiary)
April 28th Executive: here (http://213.130.50.58/clients/lbl/cediary/cgi-bin/cediaryeve.exe?EventsDiary)
* Front Page Agenda (pdf): here (http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/5E8F3D36-E411-4714-AA8A-E8D934FE1D9E/0/00Execfpspecial280406.pdf)
* Item 3 Clapham Park Stock Transfer (pdf): here (http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/64F28E4B-96C5-41F4-8F8F-CBC1021FC4D2/0/03ExecReportclaphampark180406.pdf)
Now, I challenge anyone to tell me that that Capham Park Stock Transfer document isn't written in utterly dire and inpenetrable gobbledegook. I studied some planning law and regulation in my MSc and I find that document almost incomprehensible, so I'd love to klnow how the general public are meant to be able to contribute intelligently to the debate here?
OK that is just one example, and I am sure you are going to tell me that there have been lots of "consultations" (ha ha) before now.
To take another example - I have just had a look at the license meeting documents for tomorrow for an event I am involved with and while the basic info is there (time, date, name of applicant) the most interesting stuff from mu point of view says "appended" but doesn't appear in the pdf (ie details about the single complaint about the event, a directorate request for restrictions on sound levels and any kind of description from the event organsaiers about the nature of event itself), In other words, there isn't enough information there for anyone to have any kind of informed idea about the issues involved.
I know these are just two random examples I have quickly pulled out, so without getting to hung up on the details of these two, I just want to make the basic point that there is a massive inbuilt informational bias against the general public being able to understand what is going on, let alone contribute in any meaningful way.
For that matter I have seen elected councillors sitting there in absolute confusion as to what on earth documents really mean or what is going on.
It also seems that any attempt to fix things in Lambeth involves yet more bureaucracy and gobbledegook, when in fact that is exactly the cause of a lot of the problems in the first place! It is little wobder that thing are really resolve by people talking in normal everday language down the pub or outside of meetings. Unfortunately the general public are not party to this "real" level consultation and decision making, just the "official" nonsense.
That makes sense. After reading their about page though they are still little understood for me. :confused:Ironically Lambeth First was set up as part of "consultation" to make the council more accessible and understandable to the public!
Yet further confirmation of exactly what I am saying.
memespring
24-04-2006, 20:29
Ironically Lambeth First was set up as part of "consultation" to make the council more accessible and understandable to the public!
Yet further confirmation of exactly what I am saying.
I think we need a Lambeth version of TheyWorkForYou.com (http://ww.theyworkforyou.com) ;)
lang rabbie
24-04-2006, 21:56
Ironically Lambeth First was set up as part of "consultation" to make the council more accessible and understandable to the public!
Yet further confirmation of exactly what I am saying.
I think it is fair to say that the various so-called "consultations" about Lambeth First's various "strategies" have done more to sap the goodwill of people in the voluntary and community sector than anything else I've seen in over fifteen years in Lambeth. :(
Unfortunately, because LSPs are mandated by the Government, [no party seriously looking to be in power] can stand for election on a platform of abolishing Lambeth First. :mad:
I think we need a Lambeth version of TheyWorkForYou.com (http://ww.theyworkforyou.com) ;)
www.TheyDontHaveAClue.com ?
Server not found because they don't have a clue
Firefox can't find the server at www.theydonthaveaclue.com
* Check the address for typing errors such as:
www.theyreallydon'thaveaclue.com instead of
www.theydon'thaveaclue.com
* If you are unable to load any pages, don't bother checking your computer's network connection, it's because they don't have a clue.
* If your computer or network is protected by a firewall or proxy, make sure that Firefox is permitted to access the Web, but don't bother, the clue is in the name.
Furthermore ... just as an experiment I went to the Lambeth website to have a look at the next exective meeting.
Events Diary: here (http://213.130.50.58/clients/lbl/cediary/cgi-bin/cediaryeve.exe?EventsDiary)
April 28th Executive: here (http://213.130.50.58/clients/lbl/cediary/cgi-bin/cediaryeve.exe?EventsDiary)
* Front Page Agenda (pdf): here (http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/5E8F3D36-E411-4714-AA8A-E8D934FE1D9E/0/00Execfpspecial280406.pdf)
* Item 3 Clapham Park Stock Transfer (pdf): here (http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/64F28E4B-96C5-41F4-8F8F-CBC1021FC4D2/0/03ExecReportclaphampark180406.pdf)
Now, I challenge anyone to tell me that that Capham Park Stock Transfer document isn't written in utterly dire and inpenetrable gobbledegook.
[...]
OK that is just one example, and I am sure you are going to tell me that there have been lots of "consultations" (ha ha) before now.
[...]
I know these are just two random examples I have quickly pulled out, so without getting to hung up on the details of these two, I just want to make the basic point that there is a massive inbuilt informational bias against the general public being able to understand what is going on, let alone contribute in any meaningful way.
I think you could look at this another way. The report you mention is on a feindishly complex subject without doubt. But the Exec Summary on the first page of the report is actually a pretty good summary of what the report is about and doesn't have all that much jargon in it. The recommendations on the report are pretty straightforward too. And the report author is named next to her direct line and her email address.
And as for consultation there has been over 4 years of consultation culminating in a ballot organised by the electoral reform society's ballot company.
So I think you pick a weak example there. However there are as you say plenty of complex reports where I'd accept there are councillors who don't follow the decisions they make.
You might be too cynical to accept that this issue is something I do worry about in spare moments (not that there are many of those right at the moment).
When the council had traditional committees - Environment, Housing etc - they built up a following of interested poeple who were regular attenders and speakers. Now those committees are gone (thanks to Govt. rules) and we have the Executive and scrutiny committees.
The Executive is building a following of interested people but it is smaller than the number of people who went to service committess. And scrutiny committees are often very poorly attended.
My conclusion is that for the short term this means that more reliance has to be placed on effective consultation before the report reaches the Executive - something we all know can't really be relied on.
But for the medium term I think we have to find a way to build back up the number of people who regulalry participate in decision-making at the council becuase the subjects under discussion are both interesting and intelligible.
As for the long term - I'll come back to that after May 4th!
So I think you pick a weak example there.I didn't really "pick" it - I just went to the first executive meeting listed and picked the first document listed. I accept it isn't typical, but while it is more complex than normal also not many (any?) projects have a vote organised like that either. I would welcome anyone providing a more typical example, but I still think the points I was making apply....there are as you say plenty of complex reports where I'd accept there are councillors who don't follow the decisions they make.In which case what hope does the average member of the public with no specialist knowledge, guidance or training have?You might be too cynical to accept that this issue is something I do worry about in spare moments (not that there are many of those right at the moment).No - I am happy to see that I am not completely wrong in my impression, although in some ways I would feel even happier if someone had come back and explained to me all the ways people can get information and participate in decision-making that I had overlooked and how there were local groups and local media that follow developments and provide good explanations, about how officers are helpfully explain compex issues and make these explainations publically available, about how there is a healthy and robust political debate within Lambeth which people can follow and how the issues get a good airing in a democratic and public forum.When the council had traditional committees - Environment, Housing etc - they built up a following of interested poeple who were regular attenders and speakers. Now those committees are gone (thanks to Govt. rules) and we have the Executive and scrutiny committees.
The Executive is building a following of interested people but it is smaller than the number of people who went to service committess. And scrutiny committees are often very poorly attended.
My conclusion is that for the short term this means that more reliance has to be placed on effective consultation before the report reaches the Executive - something we all know can't really be relied on.I have the same general issues with the old system as far as small groups of people who acted as a kind of 'lobby' are fair enough - but I always felt that the general population in Lambeth would have trouble walking into this kind of scenario and knowing what was going on or know how to contribute. The effort and information barrier - and also the 'cultural' barriers (in a loose sense) would mean that either you were the kind of person who would take to it or (more often than not) someone who at most would go once then decide that it was either pointless, incomprehensible or totally alien.
Furthermore I don't really see how the executive could be the same as the old committees which had a balance of councillors from both the ruling party and the opposition: what kind of debate or disagreement are you going to get within an exective that is all singing from the same sheet - that is in effect a private cabinet? It simply isn't the same dynamic - the public can't go in there and hear any kind of argument - the members of the committee can't "play to the gallery" (in a good demcratic sense) so what is the point of people going there if their arguments can't be aimed at one side or the other? They are talking to a group of people who have already decided what their policy is, don't have to win any argument and aren't faced with an organised opposition putting embaressing point forward.
As for scrutiny committees - do they really have any power once the executive has decided? If they are just powerless talking shops what motivation have people got to attend and try and make a point one way or the other?
Regarding "consultation" - even the word is worrying: participation implies an input, whereas consultation implies a survey of a passive population rather than a two-way debate. I agree that the final decision making is rightfully vested in elected councillors, but "participation" means engaging. "Consultation" makes me think of yet another expensive private market survey company sending people questionaires which get turned into powerpoint slides or cherry picked for suitable quotes before going in the bin. This to me is not healthy democratic participation or a two way process of debate, development and 'partnership'.
Even the more formal 'partnerships' that I have been involved with (1997 -2001) have been massive disappointments - with virtually zero budgets for advertising, not much help beyond a free meeting room from the council, the interest of only some officers and councillors (all credit to them but they seemed as depressed about the situtaion as us) and four years of seeing promise after promise broken and deadline after deadline pass on policies, plans, consultations - pretty much everything - only for everything to be ripped up and a new set of forums replacing the old ones. I don't get the impression that the new ones achieve any more than the old ones (I hope I am wrong) - they seem to be a way of "selling" council policies more than developing them, of coopting and diffusing anger and opposition instead of allowing it to build its own momentum and engage with directirates and the executive - keeping it at "town centre level" (for example) or wrapped up in another level that stands between local and community groups and actual decision makers.But for the medium term I think we have to find a way to build back up the number of people who regulalry participate in decision-making at the council becuase the subjects under discussion are both interesting and intelligible.I agree but it isn't just getting larger "lobby" - it is making things more transparent - which councillors and officers are actually responsible, where councillors actually stand on issues, when and how people can express opinions - and having comment and analysis of what is going on in the public realm rather than people just 'being in the know' and using their knowledge to push for their own pet ideas or projects....the Exec Summary on the first page of the report is actually a pretty good summary of what the report is about and doesn't have all that much jargon in it.To quote:
Executive Summary
The Clapham Park NDC Masterplan requires Lambeth to deliver its part of the community partnership. The implementation of the Masterplan relies on the transfer of the Council owned stock. The Masterplan includes a whole new road layout; it provides for housing estate roads to become adopted roads which will be managed and maintained by the local authority. It also builds a new school, a new park and a library, all of which LBL has agreed to fund and maintain. The report seeks final approval for the implementation of the transfer of the housing stock and delivery of the Masterplan. It reports on the proposed option to close the funding gap arising from reduced cross subsidy from market sale units. It explains the benefits of including the Clifton House site at Nos. 42 and 46 Clarence Avenue in the stock transfer package and seeks delegated authority to the Chief Executive to negotiate a final position on the Business Plan and to dispose of the Clifton House site...
Recommendations
(1) That the final negotiation on the business plan and the decision to implement the stock transfer be delegated to the Chief Executive upon receipt of consent from the Secretary of State.
(2) That the Chief Executive is authorised to negotiate and implement the disposal of Clarence Avenue and Clifton House site (42 & 46 Clarence Avenue) at best consideration, in accordance with the principles at paragraph 2.12 of this report, to Clapham Park Homes for the purpose of providing a mix of affordable rented and private sale units – the affordable element being provided for Extra Care and Sheltered Housing units for the frail and elderly as specified by Lambeth Housing and Adult and Community Services.[/I]
(And just because I have an interest in these kinds of things:)
6.2 Equalities impact assessment:
The impact of this project on BME communities is great in that the proposed works programme would significantly improve the prospects of the BME resident population which accounts for approximately half of the total population.
6.4 Environmental implications:
As part of the planning process, an Environmental Impact Assessment has been undertaken by Clapham Park and submitted to Lambeth Planning.Sorry, but this is the kind of **** makes me see red. I don't really know where to start commenting about this ... I will leave it 'till another time.
cemertyone
25-04-2006, 10:57
@Fanta:
So you have effectively decided that one man is as bad as the next? Is that just Lambeth or have you decided that any and all local government is impossible?
Dude just ignore "Fanta" he`s a trolling twat with nothing to say. He likes nothing better than to impart his ( in his mind only of course) funny liltte asides that are completly meaningless. Of course when asked to quantify anything he just goes away for a few days, only to return later like a nasty rash you thought you had got rid off.. :D
gaijingirl
25-04-2006, 18:19
ok.. I know I'm going to look a bit ignorant here, but I've just received my postal vote documents here with a list of 10 candidates (in the Tulse Hill ward) and it says "Vote for no more than THREE candidates"... how does that work? 3 - why so many?
lang rabbie
25-04-2006, 19:05
ok.. I know I'm going to look a bit ignorant here, but I've just received my postal vote documents here with a list of 10 candidates (in the Tulse Hill ward) and it says "Vote for no more than THREE candidates"... how does that work? 3 - why so many?
There are three councillors to represent the 10,000 or so people living in each "ward". There are 21 wards across the Borough = 63 councillors in all.
It's a "first-past-the-post" election, so the three people with the largest number of individual votes in each ward get elected.
gaijingirl
25-04-2006, 19:19
[QUOTE=lang rabbie]There are three councillors to represent the 10,000 or so people living in each "ward". There are 21 wards across the Borough = 63 councillors in all.
It's a "first-past-the-post" election, so the three people with the largest number of individual votes in each ward get elected.[/QUOTE
(continuing on the ignorance tack :( ) Thanks for that - so what happens if you get one Labour, one LibDem and one Green party (for example) yet the majority of councillors are LibDem - do the other two have any power???
lang rabbie
25-04-2006, 19:39
Thanks for that - so what happens if you get one Labour, one LibDem and one Green party (for example) yet the majority of councillors are LibDem - do the other two have any power???
No direct power, but if they are any good as individual ward councillors they will be able to get things done locally through persuasion/influence/constant chivvying of council officers.
So if anyone isn't absolutely convinced of the benefits of voting 100% for the Lib Dem party line ;) , I'd always suggest trying to find out something about the individual candidates' background and abilities to influence people, rather than just plumping for candidates from more than one party on some false idea of "balance".
gaijingirl
25-04-2006, 19:43
Thanks for that!!! :)
Chrysanthemum
25-04-2006, 20:29
One of the best ways of getting more people to vote...
The other big factor that would make more people vote was if local politics had more colourful personalities, if local councils had more powers, if people felt that councils didn't just pay lip service to consulting them and then go ahead and do what they intended in the first place, if the workings of the council were more transparent and made available in language that normal people could understand, if specific councillors took personal responsibilty for specific policie and decisions and were made to answer questions in public over them rather than being able to hide away in closed committee meetings in the depths of the town hall, and most importantly - if there were any actual examples of electing a councillor and it making an actual, direct and immediate difference to what happens in the local area. Part of this is the way events are covered in the media and the level of comment and analysis easily avaliable to the public.
Take a look at the Local Education Action by Parents website www.leaplambeth.org.uk
They're "colourful" if you count being :mad: and even though they have come straight out of the community, with no political experience to make them able to talk without saying anything, they have targeted the leaders of the council--the 8 on the Executive. Including everyone's favourite, the Fitchett. (I think Lumsden deserves at least a little attention here too you know)
Take a look at the Local Education Action by Parents website www.leaplambeth.org.uk
They're "colourful" if you count being :mad: and even though they have come straight out of the community, with no political experience to make them able to talk without saying anything, they have targeted the leaders of the council--the 8 on the Executive. Including everyone's favourite, the Fitchett. (I think Lumsden deserves at least a little attention here too you know)Good stuff! :)
I hope they do well - and of course it is possible to vote for them *and* vote Green as well, as you get three votes.
Kelly Rebekah b
27-07-2006, 19:37
Donatus Anyanwu - Labour
Elkin Atwell - Green
Simon Barry - Conservative
Robert Blackie - Lib Dem
Marcus Booth - Conservative
Geoffrey Bowring - Lib Dem
Rachel Braverman - Green
Rachel Heywood - Labour
Sandra Lawman - Lib Dem
Sharon Malley - Labour
Smarajit Roy - Conservative
Timothy Summers - Green
Political trivia - Smarajit Roy and his seconder Kelly Ben Maimon have both been members of all three political parties in Lambeth in the last few years.
In response to Bob the Builders trivia
I just wanted to respond to the comments made about my involvement in political parties and why I am now firmly a Conservative. It's true, I was for my sins a member of the Labour Party for a year. I live on an ex-council estate. It was stock transfered under the previous Labour run administration to a housing association. I was disgusted to see the Labour councillors not lift a finger to help, when the residents/tenant's hall was demolished to build houses. Incidentally, the housing association have not re-built a hall to this day. So, if you have asked for help from your elected representatives
and not received it, what sort of opinions would you formulate? Needless to say, I never renewed my membership with the Labour Party.
Then I became a member of the Liberal Democrats several years later. Also, it is fair to say at the same time I was appointed a school governor
and was privileged to be selected as a LA political appointee on behalf of the Lib Dems. I am still a governor to this day and play an active part in over seeing how the school is run. I find it a throughly rewarding activity.
It became increasingly clear due to the meetings I attended
at Lambeth Council who were the hardest working councillors. By this I mean the Conservatives. I was fed up with listening to Labour supporters and councillors winging on and on. It was only by carrying out my own investigations i.e.talking to ordinary people like myself, seeing the efforts the Conservatives in Lambeth were making and really taking in an interest in Conservative policies on a national level that I had done many years previously years that I realised I was always a Conservative. I was honoured to be selected to stand as a candidate by members of the Conservative Party and did recieve support from many in the community for the efforts made.
I worked alongside some of the kindest people I'd ever met in my life. I was given a chance and became part of a formidable team. If none of you have ever met Cllrs John & Clare Whelan and the former Clapham Town Tory Councillor Bernard Gentry, I strongly recommend you get in touch with the Conservative Office or visit the website at Lambeth Council. These people are one in 50 million - intelligent, hard working and genuinely represent.
There is a lot of work to be done and it has already started. Becoming a Conservative enriched my life. So yes, I was a member of other parties but I am and strongly believe I have always been a Conservative deep down.
If your going to quote triva on the website make sure it’s interesting….!!!
Kelly Rebekah ben-Maimon
Lambeth resident
Brixton Hatter
27-07-2006, 20:20
welcome to Urban75 Kelly :)
the Crack Squirrel Hunt Squad will be along in a minute to put you through your initiation ceremony... ;)
...I worked alongside some of the kindest people I'd ever met in my life. I was given a chance and became part of a formidable team. If none of you have ever met Cllrs John & Clare Whelan and the former Clapham Town Tory Councillor Bernard Gentry, I strongly recommend you get in touch with the Conservative Office or visit the website at Lambeth Council. These people are one in 50 million - intelligent, hard working and genuinely represent....
ah, that'll be the 'kind' John Whelan who slagged me off in a private email to fellow tory councillors....but accidently copied the email to.....me!
Hiya Kelly,
Nice to see politically involved people using this website. No doubt you will get some people ranting at you for being a hated 'Tory' - I myself support the Green Party and can't say I am the biggest fan of the Whelans or the previous LibDem/Con council due to issue to do with the cannabis festival and the urban green fair. However I do hope you stick around and use u75 to discuss local issues and voice any criticism of the Labour council that you might have. IMO it is more healthy for the democratic process to have public debate that anyone can read and take part in than for this to be restricted to people who can make it to the Town Hall and have enough knowledge about all the jargon and ins-and-outs of things to understand what is going on.
It is also good for gossip as well. ;)
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