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Oil Prices at record high - $145 a barrel

Discussion in 'transport' started by roryer, Apr 15, 2008.

  1. gentlegreen

    gentlegreen Nadie espera a la babosa española

    blimey - that's 29 watts :(

    It'd take 3 hours of charging from a 1 m squared panel to power my imaginary electric bicycle for my two half hour commutes.
  2. roryer

    roryer 道可道非常道,名可名非常名

    For Power infrastructures I can only guess, I only know about transport, but I think it possible that within 20 years we will discover ways to produce massive amounts of energy through various sources, but despite this I doubt if we will ever be able to replace fossil fuels.

    The only temporary solution is coal, but the consequences of this on the climate could be so profound that it makes our planet un inhabitable.

    For transport we need to move towards localisation of resources where possible, with freight transport organised in the most energy efficient way, this will be mostly sea, some rail and local road.

    Cities, suburbs and towns must prioritise walking and cycling, and efforts should be made to ensure that each is a workable community, with adequate access to work, goods and services.

    Efficient public transport, probably BRT (bus rapid transit) or LRT networks should link these population centres together.

    Rural towns should also be mainly by walking and cycle, but intra-village transport would contnue to be based on small vehicles, such as cars, as public transport is unworkable in the case of dispersed populations.

    The costs of travel should be such that it discourages rural areas existing as domitory towns or 'Ex-burbs' as many areas often termed 'rural' are today.

    A transport system like would be very low energy, but actually improve accessiblity, effciency and quality of life.
  3. david dissadent

    david dissadent New Member

    Algae is very difficult to cultivate as it requires relatively stable heat, salinity and water quality. It also needs to be protected from predation and invasion by other spieces. Hydrogen is rather difficult to collect. Scaling up these sort of biofuels is a long long way away. Currently hydrogen algeas are only produced in bioreactors, and then in nothing remotely resembling comercial quantities. When you can put a price on producing megajoules and gigajoules worth of hydrogen then come back with the figures and its sources so we can have a look. Otherwise its vapourware.

    there is a reason its so easy to poke holes in the solutions often offered. They are extreamly immature technologies that often are not remotely scaleable and in many cases do not return a postive energy return on investment. Show me the numbers or get ready to power-down.


    An internet forums discussion on a high school project. Could you not find something vaguely accademic?
    This is a research project into a potential new source of energy for satalites. No mention of it being available in a scale and at a cost to compete with our current gas fired power station fleet.

    Our gas is running out rapidly yet to fuel up your hypothetical fuel cells our electric grids will need a massive boost in both generating capacity and load carrying capacity.

    You have two choices, find new sources of economicaly extractable energy in one hell of a hurry or start using less. The energy crisis is not mearly about peak oil, it started when our ability to increase oil and energy was being outstripped by demand from new economic growth. The power down has begun. You see it on the news these days. The budget airline industry is the first obvious sign. The idea that we would for many years to come be able to increase oil production to meet increasing demand from more and more flights is now hitting the brick wall of geology and engineering. Airlines all over the world are going bust as their bussiness models did not account for such low growth in oil supply. It is a foretaste of what is to come.
  4. djbombscare

    djbombscare Plays with knives


    I've been saying for donkeys years now that If we could come up with a viable power infrastruture, then freight could be moved onto rail networks which will be extremelly beneficial and keep the goods flowing. We also have an infrastructure that enables working from home.

    Taxation breaks or anything that assists these would no doubt make a huge differnec and I think would see dramatic results quite quickly. However in order for it to be beneficial and not just a switch from one fossil fuel to another there has to be a power infrastructure that is based on alternative fuels.

    Now as much as the ones I have come up with are currentlly in their infancy. With the current public demand and investment in green areas. I can see these being new and realistic alternatives in the near future.

    Even quicker if the govt can find a way to raise revenue from them.
  5. djbombscare

    djbombscare Plays with knives

    Thats a bit doom and gloom though isnt it. Do you not think that we could develop these technoligies into viable solutions before we run out.
  6. WouldBe

    WouldBe non smoking

    There's something not quite right there.

    This solar panel is 1.25 m2 and generates 150W http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=97381
  7. roryer

    roryer 道可道非常道,名可名非常名

    Before we run out perhaps, as we should have about 100 years, but before the depletion of oil supplies force prices to rise to curtail demand, is of course impossible.

    Anyway, a world which is less profligate in its energy use for pointless consumption could create a better society.

    While Standards of Living have skyrocketed, in that we all have TV's, mobile phones and many of us have cars, our happiness as a society has dropped, as we have adopted consumerism as a measure of success and lost many aspects of strong community.

    Rising to the challenge of Peak Oil is not just about finding new energy sources, but also finding community solutions to reduce energy use.

    If we start to transition now, we have the chance to arrive at a point where Quality of Life rises, despite a drop in Standard of Living.
  8. djbombscare

    djbombscare Plays with knives

    totally.

    I know that we do what we can to curtail inefficient energy consumption. I dont belive that there is one solution to the problem as its more a population dependancy on fossil fuels and consumerism.

    Interesting to see the changes starting to happen. Consumerism grinding to a halt as the bills from 10 years of borrowed spending come in. Banks going down as people cant afford to pay. Thats manufacturing and financial sectors looking rubbish. Technology and communication investments seem to have had their boom days sooooooo Green investments as the next biggy?

    EDF investment going down the nuclear route today. . . not the long term answer but a step.

    In my book its a long road, and Im sure the govt will drag what heels it can to make as much cash as possible for as long as possible. One thing that has come to light in the last year is that the Govt seem to have started listening to public opinion, and public opinion is green fuels.

    I think the changes are starting
  9. david dissadent

    david dissadent New Member

    7% of all global flights are being cut this year. Ford and GM are shutting down production of most of there SUV and personal truck ranges. The US used 800 000 barrels a day less this summer than last. Demand destruction is already here.

    The first phase of peak oil has not been about depletion, but the lack of sufficient growth. This has nearly brought two of the greatest icons of industrial capitalism to there knees (GM and Ford). It has brought a steady stream of dying airlines aroudn the world and exburbs in the US.
  10. Gixxer1000

    Gixxer1000 cant wheelie a shaftie :(

    Yeah they are all paying heed:rolleyes:
  11. david dissadent

    david dissadent New Member

    Closes below $90. I guess there is an America sized crater in the global economy right about now.
  12. free spirit

    free spirit more tea vicar?

    no it's not, it's around 2.5kwh or around 9MJ per day average

    at least the figure for leeds from nasa's solar calculator is 2.52kwh per day average for a flat surface.

    figure at the optimum angle of tilt is around 2.8-3kwh per m2 average across the UK.

    also is your figure for energy use for homes just the electricity usage? Most houses use way more kwh gas for heating and hot water than they do kwh electricity, and solar water heating panels are way more efficient than solar pv, so for most houses you'd want to use roofspace for solar water heating panels first, before thinking about pv.


    not that any of this massively changes the gist of your argument of course.
  13. Oswaldtwistle

    Oswaldtwistle Banned

    Oil is back over $50 a barrel. Is it a blip or are we going up again I wonder??
  14. Kanda

    Kanda Nosh Wagon

    Due to the Gaza conflict.
  15. Crispy

    Crispy Fond of drink and industry

    More likely the imminent OPEC production cut.

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