Norway: Oslo bomb and island shooting spree kills over 70 people

The question wasn't about restricting legal rights. It was about giving him a platform. I think you've misunderstood what both bigus dickus and I have said.

I'm finding it very difficult to distinguish between your concept of 'a platform' and 'offering a defence'.

All executions, by which I mean legitimate and others justifiable during conflict, are subject to the agreement/support of those in power, otherwise they'd be illegal ie murder. I've no problem with a post revolutionary society dealing with reactionaries and gangsters as it saw fit.

I'm not an authoritarian, neither however do I have any compunction about Breivik being executed. I don't want to restrict his rights, i'm in favour of a full open, justicie system with full appeal rights etc. But we know there is no grey area with this individual, as such frankly there's oxygen he uses that could be put to better use.

I don't think you followed the post. It wasn't about his inadequacies, it was about 'platform'.

Agreed, precisely why there is no need for the sort of OMG people will hear his views approach. People aren't stupid, they know what he is - reporting on and allowing him to speak isn't going to turn anyone. If you're the sort whose excited by this stuff then it's all already out there - mainstream papers link to his 'manifesto', his vids take 1 second to find. If you're going to emulate him you're not going to do it on the basis of him being allowed to make a rambling incoherent dick of himself in the dock.

Guilt isn't the point here, it wasn't the point of the analogy - which is what uses you will allow to be made of a courtroom. That's the point of the analogy - and anyway, plenty of the people who famously turned trials into political trials - the ones we remember and celebrate - were guilty as hell, which is often what led them to take that course of action.

Who is saying that?

And how many exceptions are possible before all those high ideals disappear down the shitter?

After the revolution, will there be no one who wants to abuse their power simply because we will have somehow achieved utopia, or will we have to find ways to ensure that power cannot be abused?

You

Show me the post where I say that.


I want to deny him a platform because he wants one. I want to deny him part of what he did this for.

He isn't offering a defence. He is offering a political justification.

In this post for starters.

Extraordinary isn't it.

And how does that differ from a defence, precisely?

You're very clever, knowing what people think better than they know themselves. I want to deny him what he wants in order, primarily, to piss him off.

The part where he admitted the crime. Unless of course, part of Norwegian law makes allowances for political justifications for mass murder?

Yep. And if it doesn't, then justice is not being trampled on by disallowing a political statement from the defendant, or at the very least not airing such a statement in public in the way that he wants.

It's not a question of protecting impressionable people from his dangerous words so much as saying that a murder trial is not to be used by the defendant as he wishes. It is a trial to decide guilt in the case in hand.

Do you think it is normal for a court to hear a guilty plea and then move straight to sentencing without any steps in between? Mandatory and fixed sentences for all crimes?

Not that I'm a fan of the British justice system but I don't recall Copeland being allowed to showboat like this.

He pleaded not guilty.

he pleaded guilty

er... copeland pleaded guilty

No, of course not. Although can't a guilty plea circumvent a trial altogether? (I'll admit my ignorance here so will gladly be proven incorrect)

you don't get to 'showboat' if that's what you're on about

Who, copeland or Brievik?

i refer you to my post 1791

Yes, but I was under the impression that Breivik had also...

*taps watch*

The very fact that you can dismiss a human being as a "piece of garbage" proves that you don't care about human rights.

Breivik pleaded not guilty. But he admitted to the killings.

Ah right. So he's playing a mitigating circumstances game. i'm in the wrong here then.